SC2Mapster

Hi. I've seen a lot of complaints about the popularity system, and I mostly agree. However, all the complaints I've seen have been in the form of a single person speaking up, or threads in numerous forums where people speak their mind. Like in all other debates, this is a very ineffective way to spread a message - it's those who shout the loudest that are being heard, and because of this Blizzard might be ignoring these threads on purpose (maybe, maybe not). For me, at least, it does not seem like they care too much.

I was thinking, isn't it much better to organize a better way to deliver a complaint, with much more power and weight behind it? If we get enough signatures, a petition might do the trick, and might get much more attention by Blizzard than anything else so far. I have looked around to see if a petition like this already exist, but haven't found any so far. If it does, please tell me.

The problem is just that English is not my first language, and I do not have any experience with creating petitions. So I'm just going to start this thread by making a suggestion, and you guys can tell me how to improve it, before I create it.

My suggestion is to just have: "Sign this petition if you do not approve of the current popularity system used by Battle.net 2.0 on custom map hosting in Starcraft 2."

My idea is not to have any suggestion about how blizzard may improve it. First of all, I think they are perfectly capable of making a decent system themselves, and secondly, if we add a suggestion many disagree with the signatures will get much less signatures.

What do you think? Is it any point in this at all? And how can I improve it?

EDIT: OK, this is not a discussion about if you think it will work or not. Please, don't post more posts about why you don't think it will work - unless you have a better idea.

I remember months ago, during the beta, Team Liquid had a poll "do you like the popularity system", if memory serves several THOUSAND people voted "no" and a couple hundred voted "yes". The poll was like 95% against the popularity system, what did Blizzard do in the face of such overwhelming disapproval? Not a damn thing, Blizzard doesn't care what the community wants, so a petition, like that poll, will do nothing.

The popularity system isn't that bad, if you're popular (and thus have 200 friends to play for 5 minutes and then leave a few times per hour) then your map will go to the top! :D

@Colt556: Go

But a poll like that has no credibility what so ever. They're often very easy to hack, where you somehow manage to vote for the same thing many times.

Edit: What I hope I can manage for "my" petition is that if one signs he/she would have to confirm his email. This way it's much harder to cheat.

Also: It's not like I care THAT much about this whole thing. I just think it's interesting to see if I can pull this off.

@DeathStair: Go

When no LAN was announced, people petitioned, Blizzard didn't do jack. And TL is a reputable source, especially with r1ch behind everything.

Blizzard doesn't care about the community, only naive fanboys think they still do. The ONLY way you'd get Blizzard to fix their broken system is if you make them fix it, make it unplayable so that everybody bitches. As it is now, we all bitch but we still use it, and play it. So they don't give a shit. When an entire part of their game is rendered unusable, then they might.... might care. Then again they might not, probably wont. Sigh, big corporations for the lose.

@dddarrenccc: Go

Call me stubborn, but I don't think it's fair to compare them with allowing LAN and changing the popularity system. If they allowed LAN it would probably lead to more piracy. Changing the popularity system would probably do only good. But I don't think they are prioritizing this ATM, possibly because they don't realize how many who are disliking the current system.

Ps: I bought SC2 mainly because of good custom maps. If I had known how disappointed I got, I would not have bought it.

Anti-piracy is not why they removed LAN. SC had Lan, it sold millions, WC3 had lan, it sold millions. SC2 having land wouldn't have done anything. And if memory serves they flat out said piracy wasn't why they removed it. So yeah, it is the same issue. Blizzard simply does not care about the community anymore, they've gotten to the point where they don't NEED to care.

Small companies HAVE to care about their consumers, or they'll go out of business. Blizzard has gotten to the stage where it's such a massive company, nothing it does will ever negatively effect it. It's like Activision now, aslong as it can make a quick buck, it doesn't care. Why should they give two shits if you're happy? They made their money, and they'll continue to make money because you guys will continue to buy their games, because they're blizzard.

This is a fundamental truth for all big business', small companies make money with great customer service, big companies make money by shelling out as much mediocre product as possible. Blizzard is no different. Accept it, they don't care :/

@DeathStair: Go

They removed LAN because of Korea and pro-gaming. With LAN, pro-gamers can set up tournaments without dealing with Blizzard, AKA Blizzard gets no cash. With the BNET 2.0, setting up a tournament HAVE to go through BNET, so Blizzard gets money per SC2 bought. I also heard that you need Blizzard approval if you wish to set up a public tournament or something.

They care about money not the community.

@dddarrenccc and Colt556

this is not a discussion about if you think it will work or not. Please, don't post more posts about why you don't think it will work - unless you have a better idea.

We're just explaining why it's a waste of time, and why people wont get onboard with the idea. The petition route has been done numerous times, by people far more famous and reputable then you (no offense intended, but... they're more famous and reputable...) and even with all that, Blizzard ignored them. Some random guy who just made an account trying to make a petition, while admirable, wont work. Frankly at this point, your best bet is to look at that "improving the popularity system" thread and get on with that, since if anything's gonna work, it's that... even though that wont work either.

Really, our BEST bet is to hack the fuck out of SC2 and set up our own bnet. There's this program where you can use lan and set-up lobbies for various games. We'd need something like that, only with bnet, so we can bypass Blizzard's bullshit in it's entirety. But unless that happens, we're pretty much stuck since Blizzard's the big company, and we're the lowely consumers whom they ignore.

@Colt556: Go

I understand that you don't like the idea, and why. You have already told me several times, and I have already implied that I quite frankly don't care (no offence, of course). I do not understand why we are still discussing this. The thing is: if you don't play you can't win.

"The petition route has been done numerous times, by people far more famous and reputable then you" You have failed to give me an example of this so far. I feel that the LAN petition is a different story.

Team Liquid had several polls on the subject, and they're one of, if not the most reputable sources for SC. If they failed, the little guys like us will never succeed. But look, we told you why it wont work, if you're still determined then more power to you, I'm not trying to bring you down, just making sure you know the full extent of what you're getting into. If you still feel the need to go forth, then by all means, go forth. One way or the other, good luck.

Don't worry DeathStair, Colt is under the impression that people here actually care about his (ill-informed) opinion of Blizzard.

lmao, and in come the fanboys. It's not like Blizzard's actions alone scream what I've been saying. Stop defending blizzard, they don't deserve it.

Well... I was shocked today. I found a hint. A Hint that Blizzard is actually doing something about this... from Gamasutra

Quote: "One of the major Battle.net updates currently in the works is the StarCraft II Marketplace. There, modders will be able to share their creations with StarCraft II players, who will be able to browse, download, comment on, rate and also buy mods if their creators choose to price them. Modders would share any revenue with Blizzard."

Now we pray to Blizzard to bring the Marketplace now!!!

Source: http://www.udmod.com/showthread.php?1174

@HELLYAH: Go

Only when money is concerned, does Blizzard decide to change.

Why would we pray for Blizzard to ruin bnet even more? Notice how there was no "and play" in that list? We can already browse, download, comment on, and rate maps as is. All the marketplace adds is a way for map makers to charge for their maps, and that's not a good thing.

@Colt556: Go

OK. Fine, thanks, whatever. Please, if you're going to post more in this thread, stay on topic! You've repeated yourself 5 or 6 times now, only in the first page of the thread. I did not make this thread to hear how much people dislike Blizzard (notice how I have not expressed my opinion on this matter - but you seem to know what I feel nevertheless), or that they don't care about anything else than $$ (which I'm perfectly aware of).

The thing here is that I know all companies are interested in their reputation. Reputation=money. If we can show them that a thousand people or more are sick and tired of the current system, I hope and believe that they might prioritize differently. What I've noticed earlier is that for example when blizzard announced that real life names was required for the forum accounts, something like 100 pages was filled with complaints from people. The interesting thing was that I read about this in a totally different gaming news source. I was hoping that if I could get enough people to sign the petition, perhaps the petition could get the same kind of attention (aim for the top, right?).

And, as I've already said, polls on forums usually has no credibility what so ever. Very often the result from polls like that are not realistic. First of all, they are only signed by people who browse the TL forum. These are also the guys with the strongest opinions, and they represent the hardcore scene. Secondly, it's possible, and maybe even likely, that one person has signed it 100 times. It doesn't represent the general SC2 player at all IMO. If I make a petition I know at least 4 or 5 different forums I will post it on, and hopefully the word will spread.

And the last point is: even if it fails, it doesn't matter! I just want to see how far I can get this thing. It's no huge deal for me if nothing significant happens, and I'm aware of that is what is most likely. But it's fun and interesting anyway, and I'd rather do this than to just wait it out, which is uninteresting and boring.

Meh doubt it will work but w.e:

We, the undersigned, being users of StarCraft II: Wings of Liberty, ask that Activision Blizzard remove, replace, or change the current popularity system used to one with more listing options or reuse the system that StarCraft, StarCraft: Brood War, Warcraft III: Reign of Chaos, Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne uses.

We regard the current system as flawed, specific descriptions of those flaws can be found on battle.net, sc2mapter.com, and other resources, and want Activision Blizzard to take measures to improve the system in the interest of the community.

Sign Below: