Heh, can't say I'm terribly surprised. It is made extra hilarious by the little text in the bottom right "EXPERIENCE THOUSANDS OF NEW GAMES CREATED BY THE BLIZZARD COMMUNITY!" The old brood wars scene was much the same, it just wasn't so neatly arranged as it is now. Just wait for one refresh, and countless defenses and special forces would be there to greet you. Had to wait quite awhile to see some other stuff, typically.
Just checked EU server on top maps, 3 Desert Strikes, 2 Squadrons, really??? No comments and facepalm.
what exactly is the problem? it has always been like that. BUT 3.0 really made it easier to get ppl play your map. I'll host my map and i am able to get a full house with 12 players now. this was impossible before 3.0.
the sad thing is that it took them 5 years to get where wc3 started.
I agree with funky. Hell, we've been able to revive barcraft after it's been dead for 2 years. If you host something - there is a fair chance that it'll get checked by people, of course the regular rules still apply (the less players map requires - the better it'll be at initial exposure before it has fanbase).
but it has always been like that, we have x mineralz, x amount of desert strikes, x squadrons, maybe with different names but the concept stays the same.
maps are easy to get into, require (at least not required) no micro and are not too difficult. why shouldn't they be top played?
i agree, increasing visibility would be great, but not sure if more categories would help. i like the focus on the open games list.
as i said in another post recommender would be THE thing here. i know they got hyped and are everwhere but here they actually make sense.
if i buy a new set of wheels amazon doesnt need to recommend me another set of wheels, that's stupid, i dont need another one, but it fits exactly the arcade. also item and user similarities aren't so hard to implement, actually i could do it or anyone with programming xp.
also a search that reminds me at the pre-google ara doesn't fit to something that wants to be a platform. if i enter the search term "night of the dead" it shouldn't show NotD only but all maps that have the same theme (ua3, notd:So, trd). tagging our maps as it is done with websites etc.
but let's be honest, it took them 5 years to get where we are now (which would be fine for me now, i can play and test my maps) ignoring everything they learnt with sc1 and wc3. even though i have the feeling they have read my lists with improvements i doubt they will ever impl. the things mentioned here within reasonable time (5 years isnt).
The only time b.net 2.0 ever really worked well was when it was 'bugged'. Anyone remembered back near launch, the popularity system was bugged and it was not remembering any popularity at all? So page 1 was constantly filled with new maps. A map gets played and quickly forgotten, so another takes its place. If you launch a brand new unknown map, it gets filled up very fast. I've played more maps during those couple days than pretty much any other period of time.
Also during launch, blizzard was resetting server every other day - and brand new maps would pop up during a reset. People immediately jumps to play any new maps. So there was a very strong interest in new maps. (at some point, blizzard 'fixed' a blank reset and starts filling it with the same top 10 maps after a reset...)
In a nutshell, the popularity system killed the Arcade. So a fix is to remove it altogether.
Instead of a top 10 system, remove any 'popularity sorting' system and just have the top 100 show a list of the last 100 most recently played in the order they appear. Popular maps would still show up in this list very often, but no longer in the same top spot. So a new map in this list would pop up and get attention.
This is like the open map listing, but instead of disappearing when it starts, it simply shows up in the browse page replacing the devastating popular browsing system.
The only time b.net 2.0 ever really worked well was when it was 'bugged'. Anyone remembered back near launch, the popularity system was bugged and it was not remembering any popularity at all? So page 1 was constantly filled with new maps. A map gets played and quickly forgotten, so another takes its place. If you launch a brand new unknown map, it gets filled up very fast. I've played more maps during those couple days than pretty much any other period of time.
Also during launch, blizzard was resetting server every other day - and brand new maps would pop up during a reset. People immediately jumps to play any new maps. So there was a very strong interest in new maps. (at some point, blizzard 'fixed' a blank reset and starts filling it with the same top 10 maps after a reset...)
In a nutshell, the popularity system killed the Arcade. So a fix is to remove it altogether.
Instead of a top 10 system, remove any 'popularity sorting' system and just have the top 100 show a list of the last 100 most recently played in the order they appear. Popular maps would still show up in this list very often, but no longer in the same top spot. So a new map in this list would pop up and get attention.
This is like the open map listing, but instead of disappearing when it starts, it simply shows up in the browse page replacing the devastating popular browsing system.
Just checked EU server on top maps, 3 Desert Strikes, 2 Squadrons, really??? No comments and facepalm.
Kovin... It is perhaps a little unfair to capture that screen image so soon after an outage (reset stats?) for a patch upgrade.
It's better to wait a while for the real numbers to come in, and they change the picture a bit:
You might see some games here that you offer more variety ... i think you probably know some of them :)
That [Probes vs Zealot 2] looks pretty interesting ... might go try that right now.
the popularity system was bugged and it was not remembering any popularity at all? So page 1 was constantly filled with new maps. A map gets played and quickly forgotten, so another takes its place. If you launch a brand new unknown map, it gets filled up very fast. I've played more maps during those couple days than pretty much any other period of time.
The "Up and coming" list is a joke. there are maps from 2010 on the "up and coming" list; which haven't been played at all. There are also maps like "Squad TD" on there, which are more of "Solidified in history" than "up and coming".
the "top rated" list is a half joke. Why? Well, for a map to make the "top rated" list, it needs to have been one of the top maps for a while. While this is nice for some maps (Ultimate boss battles as an example) to get exposure to new players who haven't experienced them. For the most part though; this list is very similar to the top played list. If it couldn't contain any maps from the first 2 pages of "top played" I think it would do much better.
The top played list isn't bad; considering the arcade setup now days. As others have said, it does not take long to get any game started.
The "newest" tab is pretty good; it lets you check out new maps as they are added. The problem is that a lot of maps are added on a weekly basis. IF most people aren't going more than 3 tabs deep on the "top played" list, how deep do you think they will go into the "newest" tab? What I have seen from this, is that some editor will release their game with a slightly different name every couple of week, so they stay high on the "newest" list. but also, complete garbage maps (no offense if effort was actually put into them) where people just drop a few units on a map and upload it, because they do not know how to use the editor, are in the mix.
The current arcade is the best yet; all it really needs now is a way to get more exposure to games without someone constantly spamming arcade chat to get people to join.
Yeah, said this from the beginning: the solution is to simply remove the popularity system altogether. Have no category for "Top Played". If people want to play a map so desperately, they can pick it out from their bookmark instead of finding it in top played - if a player really liked a map, he'll remember it and try to play it again, he doesn't need "Top Played" list. I think a lot of people just play the top played maps because they believe there is no point playing any other map because there's no players for them. This popularity system creates a destructive herd mentality.
Although, map makers need to also understand marketing techniques. You must make your map stand out in a good way that encourages people to play it. Maps not on page 1 still do get quite a few players thanks to this.
Yeah, said this from the beginning: the solution is to simply remove the popularity system altogether. Have no category for "Top Played". If people want to play a map so desperately, they can pick it out from their bookmark instead of finding it in top played - if a player really liked a map, he'll remember it and try to play it again, he doesn't need "Top Played" list. I think a lot of people just play the top played maps because they believe there is no point playing any other map because there's no players for them. This popularity system creates a destructive herd mentality.
Although, map makers need to also understand marketing techniques. You must make your map stand out in a good way that encourages people to play it. Maps not on page 1 still do get quite a few players thanks to this.
I think with the "new" arcade system, the whole "popularity" list is pretty moot. Especially since only 1 lobby for a game is open at a time. Popular games are often at the very bottom of the game list, because they fill fast. This bumps less played maps to the top. By default, players are browsing open games when they select arcade.
In my opinion, the "top played" list is really just a ranking of sorts; a way for people and mapmakers to check out what the top games are. The way the arcade is setup though, I feel that any map being hosted has at least equal exposure, with less played maps getting more than frequently played maps.
As I mentioned above, would be if they re-did the categories to support more of the less played maps. The "up and coming" list is absolutely worthless, as is "top rated". I think it would be better if "up and coming" maps had to be less than a year old, and had to have been updated within the last month or two. This would give a lot of exposure to new maps. Right now it is actually difficult to search for a decent new map; unless someone is hosting one and trying to recruit players, it is a lost opportunity.
Just checked EU server on top maps, 3 Desert Strikes, 2 Squadrons, really??? No comments and facepalm.
http://www.youtube.com/user/RussianMapster
@KorvinGump: Go
Heh, can't say I'm terribly surprised. It is made extra hilarious by the little text in the bottom right "EXPERIENCE THOUSANDS OF NEW GAMES CREATED BY THE BLIZZARD COMMUNITY!" The old brood wars scene was much the same, it just wasn't so neatly arranged as it is now. Just wait for one refresh, and countless defenses and special forces would be there to greet you. Had to wait quite awhile to see some other stuff, typically.
what exactly is the problem? it has always been like that. BUT 3.0 really made it easier to get ppl play your map. I'll host my map and i am able to get a full house with 12 players now. this was impossible before 3.0.
the sad thing is that it took them 5 years to get where wc3 started.
I agree with funky. Hell, we've been able to revive barcraft after it's been dead for 2 years. If you host something - there is a fair chance that it'll get checked by people, of course the regular rules still apply (the less players map requires - the better it'll be at initial exposure before it has fanbase).
It's all Tya's fault !!!! Traitor !!!! I love all of his maps, especially the new one with Mannoroth icon, so i am a traitor too...
@Trieva: Go
but it has always been like that, we have x mineralz, x amount of desert strikes, x squadrons, maybe with different names but the concept stays the same. maps are easy to get into, require (at least not required) no micro and are not too difficult. why shouldn't they be top played?
@Trieva: Go
i agree, increasing visibility would be great, but not sure if more categories would help. i like the focus on the open games list.
as i said in another post recommender would be THE thing here. i know they got hyped and are everwhere but here they actually make sense.
if i buy a new set of wheels amazon doesnt need to recommend me another set of wheels, that's stupid, i dont need another one, but it fits exactly the arcade. also item and user similarities aren't so hard to implement, actually i could do it or anyone with programming xp.
also a search that reminds me at the pre-google ara doesn't fit to something that wants to be a platform. if i enter the search term "night of the dead" it shouldn't show NotD only but all maps that have the same theme (ua3, notd:So, trd). tagging our maps as it is done with websites etc.
but let's be honest, it took them 5 years to get where we are now (which would be fine for me now, i can play and test my maps) ignoring everything they learnt with sc1 and wc3. even though i have the feeling they have read my lists with improvements i doubt they will ever impl. the things mentioned here within reasonable time (5 years isnt).
The only time b.net 2.0 ever really worked well was when it was 'bugged'. Anyone remembered back near launch, the popularity system was bugged and it was not remembering any popularity at all? So page 1 was constantly filled with new maps. A map gets played and quickly forgotten, so another takes its place. If you launch a brand new unknown map, it gets filled up very fast. I've played more maps during those couple days than pretty much any other period of time.
Also during launch, blizzard was resetting server every other day - and brand new maps would pop up during a reset. People immediately jumps to play any new maps. So there was a very strong interest in new maps. (at some point, blizzard 'fixed' a blank reset and starts filling it with the same top 10 maps after a reset...)
In a nutshell, the popularity system killed the Arcade. So a fix is to remove it altogether.
Instead of a top 10 system, remove any 'popularity sorting' system and just have the top 100 show a list of the last 100 most recently played in the order they appear. Popular maps would still show up in this list very often, but no longer in the same top spot. So a new map in this list would pop up and get attention.
This is like the open map listing, but instead of disappearing when it starts, it simply shows up in the browse page replacing the devastating popular browsing system.
http://www.youtube.com/user/RussianMapster
Kovin... It is perhaps a little unfair to capture that screen image so soon after an outage (reset stats?) for a patch upgrade. It's better to wait a while for the real numbers to come in, and they change the picture a bit:
You might see some games here that you offer more variety ... i think you probably know some of them :)
That [Probes vs Zealot 2] looks pretty interesting ... might go try that right now.
I think that there could be better categories.
The "Up and coming" list is a joke. there are maps from 2010 on the "up and coming" list; which haven't been played at all. There are also maps like "Squad TD" on there, which are more of "Solidified in history" than "up and coming".
the "top rated" list is a half joke. Why? Well, for a map to make the "top rated" list, it needs to have been one of the top maps for a while. While this is nice for some maps (Ultimate boss battles as an example) to get exposure to new players who haven't experienced them. For the most part though; this list is very similar to the top played list. If it couldn't contain any maps from the first 2 pages of "top played" I think it would do much better.
The top played list isn't bad; considering the arcade setup now days. As others have said, it does not take long to get any game started.
The "newest" tab is pretty good; it lets you check out new maps as they are added. The problem is that a lot of maps are added on a weekly basis. IF most people aren't going more than 3 tabs deep on the "top played" list, how deep do you think they will go into the "newest" tab? What I have seen from this, is that some editor will release their game with a slightly different name every couple of week, so they stay high on the "newest" list. but also, complete garbage maps (no offense if effort was actually put into them) where people just drop a few units on a map and upload it, because they do not know how to use the editor, are in the mix.
The current arcade is the best yet; all it really needs now is a way to get more exposure to games without someone constantly spamming arcade chat to get people to join.
Skype: [email protected] Current Project: Custom Hero Arena! US: battlenet:://starcraft/map/1/263274 EU: battlenet:://starcraft/map/2/186418
Yeah, said this from the beginning: the solution is to simply remove the popularity system altogether. Have no category for "Top Played". If people want to play a map so desperately, they can pick it out from their bookmark instead of finding it in top played - if a player really liked a map, he'll remember it and try to play it again, he doesn't need "Top Played" list. I think a lot of people just play the top played maps because they believe there is no point playing any other map because there's no players for them. This popularity system creates a destructive herd mentality.
Although, map makers need to also understand marketing techniques. You must make your map stand out in a good way that encourages people to play it. Maps not on page 1 still do get quite a few players thanks to this.
I think with the "new" arcade system, the whole "popularity" list is pretty moot. Especially since only 1 lobby for a game is open at a time. Popular games are often at the very bottom of the game list, because they fill fast. This bumps less played maps to the top. By default, players are browsing open games when they select arcade.
In my opinion, the "top played" list is really just a ranking of sorts; a way for people and mapmakers to check out what the top games are. The way the arcade is setup though, I feel that any map being hosted has at least equal exposure, with less played maps getting more than frequently played maps.
As I mentioned above, would be if they re-did the categories to support more of the less played maps. The "up and coming" list is absolutely worthless, as is "top rated". I think it would be better if "up and coming" maps had to be less than a year old, and had to have been updated within the last month or two. This would give a lot of exposure to new maps. Right now it is actually difficult to search for a decent new map; unless someone is hosting one and trying to recruit players, it is a lost opportunity.
Skype: [email protected] Current Project: Custom Hero Arena! US: battlenet:://starcraft/map/1/263274 EU: battlenet:://starcraft/map/2/186418