Many people, including myself, struggle to master Galaxy editor. But as you know from
BW and WC, fun games don't always need complex triggers. I was wondering if any one of
you generous people could make trigger map with template triggers so even noobs can use it to make their own maps.
For instance, map with all trigger options found in Brood War SCM Draft editor.
Like trigger for leaderboard, trigger for giving units order, trigger for randomization/switches, etc.
A separate, simplified Galaxy 3rd party editor would be awesome but perhaps thats too much to ask
If you wanna make a list of several general trigger questions, I'd think about making a simple tutorial/map file on such things.
Leaderboards basically fall under dialogs which there are already tutorials on. There are unit order tutorials too (it's basically just using the issue order action). For switch randomization you can see blizzard map examples. You just put the function random number in the main thing of the switch, then your cases are numbers.
If you wanna make a list of several general trigger questions, I'd think about making a simple tutorial/map file on such things.
Leaderboards basically fall under dialogs which there are already tutorials on. There are unit order tutorials too (it's basically just using the issue order action). For switch randomization you can see blizzard map examples. You just put the function random number in the main thing of the switch, then your cases are numbers.
Maybe I wasn't completely clear. I was think for the sake of trigger noobs, some people can help them make simple maps faster and easier.
I am hoping that whoever finds this thread later on will pick up on this and make own maps without going back and forth and finding tutorials or looking into blizzard maps (lot of time consumption). I personally won't be able to play/map for a long time because of graduate studies but I would like to see vibrant custom games community. After all its more fun than ladders imo. If only theres easier way for modders to make maps...
You know how in scm draft (BW) triggers, you had drop down list of CONDITIONS and ACTIONS triggers. If someone can make template triggers for each of those conditions/actions triggers that would be great contributions. After all not everyone is familiar with coding jargon,
some people need dumbed-down version of trigger that would be great.
i don't know scm draft but i assume things were a bit less complex back then. it would help if you would give concrete examples with both worlds, the complex and the dumbed-down version
it is against the terms of service to use a 3rd party program which alters the editor or maps. That aside:
In sc1, triggers were insanely basic. In SC2 they are much more complex. The trigger editor is what you are asking for. The idea you are thinking would be made through action definitions. Grouping clusters of actions together to create "systems" for creating things; and just having well labeled parameters to fill in the blanks. Like creating an entire leaderboard in an action definition, and having an option to alter the field name or something. (Easy example).
In sc2 however, there are so many "things" that can be done, that the vast majority of them cannot be broad enough for what you would like. To create a map capable of that would likely go over the map scrip limit, and be unusable anyway. This is why things are in separate tutorials and test maps. You can download a test map which does the above with leaderboard; and then just import the triggers from it. You could do the same with a hero selection system. You can import renees WC3 mods. If you were to take every-possible thing and put it in 1 map, your computer would melt.
You know how in scm draft (BW) triggers, you had drop down list of CONDITIONS and ACTIONS triggers. If someone can make template triggers for each of those conditions/actions triggers that would be great contributions. After all not everyone is familiar with coding jargon, some people need dumbed-down version of trigger that would be great.
The problem is that the triggers in BW work a lot different than SC2 triggers.
In BW, every single trigger was checked periodically. In SC2, the triggers are event based and are only checked when their event occurs.
-> Forget what you have learned in BW triggers.
Learn that things in SC2 start with generic things happening like a unit enters a region, a unit dies, etc.
Once you are able to think in that way and know which events exist, then you can create a correct solution for SC2.
If you would want to recreate BW's trigger system fundamentals in SC2, you would have a single trigger containing a lot of if-then which would be executed periodically.
If you have questions how to port over a few aspects of BW to SC2, just create a thread and ask. :)
For example, the switches in BW are now global variables of the type boolean. They can be true/false and you can use a function that returns a random value. So, most of the time, you simply just use a random value. Btw, global variables are created in the left panel where you can create new triggers and they can be used in all triggers. Opposing to that, there are local variables defined within triggers which are only accessible within the same trigger and its instance.
What would be close to what your asking for would be some more easy to use libraries.
For instance I use my own dialog library to create all my dialogs automatically which is a lot faster and less error prone.
Some noob friendly library might help beginers create a map without having to learn much about how dialogs work and how to hook them all up. They could simply plug in parameters and get a basic screen with buttons hooked up in 5 minutes flat. Maybe that's all they would want, otherwise they could then improve on the appearance/functionality as they begin to learn more.
Dialogs and leaderboards are the only thing I can think of that could be streamlined like that and actually be usefull to someone. Everything else is already there at you fingertips, all you have to do is type it into the search box. I mean if you want to send orders to a unit you just use the "order unit" trigger. If you want to have a switch give a random outcome you just use a random number and a switch. I can't really think how that can be simplified by placing another layer of abstraction ontop of it.
It would help if you could come up with an example.
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Many people, including myself, struggle to master Galaxy editor. But as you know from BW and WC, fun games don't always need complex triggers. I was wondering if any one of you generous people could make trigger map with template triggers so even noobs can use it to make their own maps.
For instance, map with all trigger options found in Brood War SCM Draft editor. Like trigger for leaderboard, trigger for giving units order, trigger for randomization/switches, etc.
A separate, simplified Galaxy 3rd party editor would be awesome but perhaps thats too much to ask
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Curse PremiumIf you wanna make a list of several general trigger questions, I'd think about making a simple tutorial/map file on such things.
Leaderboards basically fall under dialogs which there are already tutorials on. There are unit order tutorials too (it's basically just using the issue order action). For switch randomization you can see blizzard map examples. You just put the function random number in the main thing of the switch, then your cases are numbers.
well im not sure what exactly your looking for but I whipped this up maybe it can help you
Maybe I wasn't completely clear. I was think for the sake of trigger noobs, some people can help them make simple maps faster and easier. I am hoping that whoever finds this thread later on will pick up on this and make own maps without going back and forth and finding tutorials or looking into blizzard maps (lot of time consumption). I personally won't be able to play/map for a long time because of graduate studies but I would like to see vibrant custom games community. After all its more fun than ladders imo. If only theres easier way for modders to make maps...
You know how in scm draft (BW) triggers, you had drop down list of CONDITIONS and ACTIONS triggers. If someone can make template triggers for each of those conditions/actions triggers that would be great contributions. After all not everyone is familiar with coding jargon, some people need dumbed-down version of trigger that would be great.
i don't know scm draft but i assume things were a bit less complex back then. it would help if you would give concrete examples with both worlds, the complex and the dumbed-down version
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Curse Premiumit is against the terms of service to use a 3rd party program which alters the editor or maps. That aside:
In sc1, triggers were insanely basic. In SC2 they are much more complex. The trigger editor is what you are asking for. The idea you are thinking would be made through action definitions. Grouping clusters of actions together to create "systems" for creating things; and just having well labeled parameters to fill in the blanks. Like creating an entire leaderboard in an action definition, and having an option to alter the field name or something. (Easy example).
In sc2 however, there are so many "things" that can be done, that the vast majority of them cannot be broad enough for what you would like. To create a map capable of that would likely go over the map scrip limit, and be unusable anyway. This is why things are in separate tutorials and test maps. You can download a test map which does the above with leaderboard; and then just import the triggers from it. You could do the same with a hero selection system. You can import renees WC3 mods. If you were to take every-possible thing and put it in 1 map, your computer would melt.
To summarize: Literally impossible.
Skype: [email protected] Current Project: Custom Hero Arena! US: battlenet:://starcraft/map/1/263274 EU: battlenet:://starcraft/map/2/186418
The problem is that the triggers in BW work a lot different than SC2 triggers.
In BW, every single trigger was checked periodically. In SC2, the triggers are event based and are only checked when their event occurs.
-> Forget what you have learned in BW triggers.
Learn that things in SC2 start with generic things happening like a unit enters a region, a unit dies, etc.
Once you are able to think in that way and know which events exist, then you can create a correct solution for SC2.
If you would want to recreate BW's trigger system fundamentals in SC2, you would have a single trigger containing a lot of if-then which would be executed periodically.
If you have questions how to port over a few aspects of BW to SC2, just create a thread and ask. :)
For example, the switches in BW are now global variables of the type boolean. They can be true/false and you can use a function that returns a random value. So, most of the time, you simply just use a random value. Btw, global variables are created in the left panel where you can create new triggers and they can be used in all triggers. Opposing to that, there are local variables defined within triggers which are only accessible within the same trigger and its instance.
What would be close to what your asking for would be some more easy to use libraries.
For instance I use my own dialog library to create all my dialogs automatically which is a lot faster and less error prone.
Some noob friendly library might help beginers create a map without having to learn much about how dialogs work and how to hook them all up. They could simply plug in parameters and get a basic screen with buttons hooked up in 5 minutes flat. Maybe that's all they would want, otherwise they could then improve on the appearance/functionality as they begin to learn more.
Dialogs and leaderboards are the only thing I can think of that could be streamlined like that and actually be usefull to someone. Everything else is already there at you fingertips, all you have to do is type it into the search box. I mean if you want to send orders to a unit you just use the "order unit" trigger. If you want to have a switch give a random outcome you just use a random number and a switch. I can't really think how that can be simplified by placing another layer of abstraction ontop of it.
It would help if you could come up with an example.