1. Valve created few example maps like "Example UI", you can open this map and watching how UI works etc.
One day valve deleted supporting some function in code, it was few mounth ago, many people who using this code from Example UI from Valve get error, becouse of new update. Very funny part that they steal don't fix this error in Example UI (this tutorial map steal broken) some people like me have looked for fixing this. They don't care if someone don't work from Tutirial maps.
2. Only Valve decide to provide dedicated servers or not (for custom mods), few custom maps where on top 1 of all maps with half million subscribers and more then 16k online, they havn't dedicated server, as example - name of mod Realm of Chaos.
3. There are so many things that must be improved or fixed, but a year has passed and no changes. You can register on valve's dev site, create topic with solution but chance that someone hear you less then 1%.
4.You can't create new hero, only ovveride old. You can't create new model for hero so simple like in other editors, there are big guide for that.
You can't change regeneration, stat bonus (hp or mp) from attributes (streanght, agility ...) You must use all known system, or create alot of modifiers for every hero, item and events for hero that changes basic bonuses from attributes using modifiers.
5.In fact, promote your mod is very difficult, custom games system has a monopoly, especially from the Chinese side (there are the biggest team of dota 2 developers from CHN more then 10 peoples named Avalon Studio) they have very big support from asia, every created mod from them after 1 day in top 10 maps). Get ready for the audience of Dota 2, they can play in bad created mods with no logic, and then can hate realy cool mods created for 1 year.
Also, for several years formed a strong community of english speaking moders, they support each other too.
The main thing you need to know is that all the basic features limited so long to create something other then dota (new shop, more then 6 spells on basic UI, more then 6 items, custom hero with 3d model etc. )
1. Valve created few example maps like "Example UI", you can open this map and watching how UI works etc.
One day valve deleted supporting some function in code,it was few mounth ago, many people who using this code from Example UI from Valve get error, becouse of new update. Veryfunny part that they steal don't fix this error in Example UI (this tutorial map steal broken) some people like me have looked for fixing this. They don't care if someone don't work from Tutirial maps.
2. Only Valve decide to provide dedicated servers or not (for custom mods), few custom maps where on top 1 of all maps with half million subscribers and more then 16k online, they havn't dedicated server, as example - name of mod Realm of Chaos.
3. There are so many things that must be improved or fixed, but a year has passed and no changes. You can register on valve's dev site, create topic with solution but chance that someone hear you less then 1%.
4.You can't create new hero, only ovveride old. You can't create new model for hero so simple like in other editors, there are big guide for that.
You can't change regeneration, stat bonus (hp or mp) from attributes (streanght, agility ...) You must use all known system, or create alot of modifiers for every hero, item and events for hero that changes basic bonuses from attributes usingmodifiers.
5.In fact, promote your mod is very difficult, custom games system has a monopoly, especially from the Chinese side (there are the biggest team of dota 2 developers from CHN more then 10 peoples named Avalon Studio) they have very big support from asia, every created mod from them after 1 day in top 10 maps). Get ready for the audience of Dota 2, they can play in bad created mods with no logic, and then can hate realy cool mods created for 1 year.
Also, for several years formed a strong community of english speaking moders, they support each other too.
The main thing you need to know is that all the basic features limited so long to create something other then dota (new shop, more then 6 spells on basic UI, more then 6 items, custom hero with3d modeletc. )
In fact, promote your mod is very difficult, custom games system has a monopoly, especially from the Chinese side (there are the biggest team of dota 2 developers from CHN more then 10 peoples named Avalon Studio) they have very big support from asia, every created mod from them after 1 day in top 10 maps). Get ready for the audience of Dota 2, they can play in bad created mods with no logic, and then can hate realy cool mods created for 1 year.
Also, for several years formed a strong community of english speaking moders, they support each other too.
The main thing you need to know is that all the basic features limited so long to create something other then dota (new shop, more then 6 spells on basic UI, more then 6 items, custom hero with3d modeletc. )
F*uck chinese. I also noticed this. Dota 2 has the same problem as Starcraft 2 with popular maps on front page. Popularity should be reseted every day.
about your poll, i think sc2 editor is best, you can basically do everything that is in the scope of an rts. the competetion is more on the frontend for the user, and yes popularity systems suck.
about your poll, i think sc2 editor is best, you can basically do everything that is in the scope of an rts. the competetion is more on the frontend for the user, and yes popularity systems suck.
I agreed. In current stage sc2 arcade has insane barrier to entry. Front page is occupied by 3-5 years old maps. There is zero motivation and sense to create new maps now. This is sad, but sc2 arcade 5 years ago and sc2 now it's 2 different games.
The motivation is a subjective thing. The golden rule of life is you get as much as you invest. So it's stupid to be afraid to give something (like your labor) for free. That thing will pay off in some form soon or later. When Blizzard started working on first starcraft they just wanted to create cool game and they didn't knew for sure if it will be a profitable thing to do or not. When you do something right and enjoy what you're doing it will most likely be rewarded as i noticed from my own life experience.
The main problem is people want to get exactly money from their modding work and immediately. I think for now thats not how it works at least for sc2. It still pretty hobby-kind-of activity. Even arcade contests don't change that thing. I personaly don't regret any time i invest in sc2 editor even though i didnt manage to finish any project or gain some money from donation or whatever. Because it helped to develop my critical thinking even further. Solving some issues or problems, finding the logical connections between things is realy fun imo.
Here is my thoughts why sc2 custom scene failed:
- The sc2 editor is a professional tool that pretty much stands with software like 3dsmax, adobe illustrator or unity in terms of complexity (+/-). That tools in opposite to the game editor could provide you with a work that will give you food for life and money to pay the bills.
Basicaly that means you need to have a full time work AND also invest time in the modding but level of complexity and learning curve doesn't fit with people's demand for a casual tool for playing with gameplay ideas and stuff, it basicaly drains your life instead.
- There is too much time and efforts must be invested to hit the bar of "Personal Achievement" as a moder.
I realy want to emphasise this. I think a lot of people making mods to create something unique, bring some mechanics that noone else think of or implement some genius gameplay system or whatever. In starcraft 1 for example someone developed a cargo-based dialogs and inventory and that was cool and interesting but also pretty simple. In starcraft 2 a lot of systems are given by default and modder need to investigate another areas where he can break the limits of the tool to impress himself and the others, because i think this exactly what makes modding fun and satisfying. And there is much harder to do so because this editor basicaly have presets for everything and your creativity is somewhat limited. You basicaly need to do a routine work within a given framework (editing data fields) instead of inventing a bicycle. But inventing your own bicycle is the main fun factor, even if it has square wheels it still cool just because it's unique.
Basicaly what i'm trying to say that some hobby-modding-oriented people would prefer to work with limited toolset and utilize that few lego bricks to create some simple but unique systems which will also satisfy their need for "Personal Achievement" in a timely manner. I think this is the main reason why some people are using wc3 editor and even sc1 editor even nowadays.
Introducing the Custom Game Pass, a new system for supporting and rewarding custom game developers who are committed to building vibrant and lasting communities around their games.
Custom Games Passes will be limited to a small number of high-quality games that have established themselves in the community. Purchasing a pass directly supports the creators of the custom game as well as granting you extra features for that game. All custom games will remain free to download and play.
The first Custom Game Pass will be available for Roshpit Champions at a price of $1 for a 30-day duration. While everyone can play Roshpit Champions for free, the Custom Game Pass will enable additional stash and character slots, and offer multiple perks for the duration of the pass.
The sc2 editor is a professional tool that pretty much stands with software like 3dsmax, adobe illustrator or unity in terms of complexity (+/-). That tools in opposite to the game editor could provide you with a work that will give you food for life and money to pay the bills.
Anybody who has said this obviously hasn't spent any significant time in the Dota 2 workshop tools. The Starcraft II editor is BY FAR the easiest tool for RTS modding since the Warcraft III editor. You can make full fledged custom games without any knowledge of scripting, and although the data GUI is a clusterfuck it is by far less intimidating than scripting in Lua for Dota 2. The dota 2 terrain editor also requires you to subdivide quads and do a bunch of other real annoying professional shit that is simply not required in SC2. Even simple things like linking/importing assets is by far more streamlined and easy than the dota 2 tools.
Want to make building construction in dota? hope you want to create an entirely custom library, want to do resource gathering? do your own library. want to have a command card? Do it yourself.
There has been like a year and a half of development on the dotacraft library and even it feels super shitty to play and doesn't work well. Basically if you don't want to make a map that plays just like dota or something simple like a tower defense you're completely fucked. I'm pretty sure you still can't create a tilemap bigger than the default dota map without completely breaking the fog of war system.
With the amount of time and work it takes to make something in Dota 2 you might as well just become an indie developer because it's not a comprehensive tool like the SC2 editor that does a bunch of the hard legwork for you.
How is that even a question? I can create Dota2 with the SC2 editor. I can't create SC2 with the Dota2 editor. (and sometimes I can't even create SC2 in the SC2 editor^^)
so you quoted random sentence from my post just to legitimate your shit that doesn't correspond anyhow to what i was talking about. Seems legit.
I dont see what from your post was questioned by me. So next time you want to do in-depth comparsion between d2 and sc2 modding don't put my quotations in there okay.
The SC2 tools in no way even compare to the difficulty associated with professional tools such as Unity, Unreal or Source. The people who say the SC2 tools are too difficult weren't serious modders in Warcraft III and really didn't spend more than a week in the sc2 editor.
could you elaborate on this?
Ok let's go
1. Valve created few example maps like "Example UI", you can open this map and watching how UI works etc.
One day valve deleted supporting some function in code, it was few mounth ago, many people who using this code from Example UI from Valve get error, becouse of new update. Very funny part that they steal don't fix this error in Example UI (this tutorial map steal broken) some people like me have looked for fixing this. They don't care if someone don't work from Tutirial maps.
2. Only Valve decide to provide dedicated servers or not (for custom mods), few custom maps where on top 1 of all maps with half million subscribers and more then 16k online, they havn't dedicated server, as example - name of mod Realm of Chaos.
3. There are so many things that must be improved or fixed, but a year has passed and no changes. You can register on valve's dev site, create topic with solution but chance that someone hear you less then 1%.
4.You can't create new hero, only ovveride old. You can't create new model for hero so simple like in other editors, there are big guide for that.
You can't change regeneration, stat bonus (hp or mp) from attributes (streanght, agility ...) You must use all known system, or create alot of modifiers for every hero, item and events for hero that changes basic bonuses from attributes using modifiers.
5.In fact, promote your mod is very difficult, custom games system has a monopoly, especially from the Chinese side (there are the biggest team of dota 2 developers from CHN more then 10 peoples named Avalon Studio) they have very big support from asia, every created mod from them after 1 day in top 10 maps). Get ready for the audience of Dota 2, they can play in bad created mods with no logic, and then can hate realy cool mods created for 1 year.
Also, for several years formed a strong community of english speaking moders, they support each other too.
The main thing you need to know is that all the basic features limited so long to create something other then dota (new shop, more then 6 spells on basic UI, more then 6 items, custom hero with 3d model etc. )
please add some formatting to your text. click on the link to find wiki creol modifiers.
nice
F*uck chinese. I also noticed this. Dota 2 has the same problem as Starcraft 2 with popular maps on front page. Popularity should be reseted every day.
P.S. added poll to thread.
http://www.youtube.com/user/RussianMapster
@DEFILERRULEZ: Go
about your poll, i think sc2 editor is best, you can basically do everything that is in the scope of an rts. the competetion is more on the frontend for the user, and yes popularity systems suck.
I agreed. In current stage sc2 arcade has insane barrier to entry. Front page is occupied by 3-5 years old maps. There is zero motivation and sense to create new maps now. This is sad, but sc2 arcade 5 years ago and sc2 now it's 2 different games.
http://www.youtube.com/user/RussianMapster
The motivation is a subjective thing. The golden rule of life is you get as much as you invest. So it's stupid to be afraid to give something (like your labor) for free. That thing will pay off in some form soon or later. When Blizzard started working on first starcraft they just wanted to create cool game and they didn't knew for sure if it will be a profitable thing to do or not. When you do something right and enjoy what you're doing it will most likely be rewarded as i noticed from my own life experience.
The main problem is people want to get exactly money from their modding work and immediately. I think for now thats not how it works at least for sc2. It still pretty hobby-kind-of activity. Even arcade contests don't change that thing. I personaly don't regret any time i invest in sc2 editor even though i didnt manage to finish any project or gain some money from donation or whatever. Because it helped to develop my critical thinking even further. Solving some issues or problems, finding the logical connections between things is realy fun imo.
Here is my thoughts why sc2 custom scene failed:
- The sc2 editor is a professional tool that pretty much stands with software like 3dsmax, adobe illustrator or unity in terms of complexity (+/-). That tools in opposite to the game editor could provide you with a work that will give you food for life and money to pay the bills.
Basicaly that means you need to have a full time work AND also invest time in the modding but level of complexity and learning curve doesn't fit with people's demand for a casual tool for playing with gameplay ideas and stuff, it basicaly drains your life instead.
- There is too much time and efforts must be invested to hit the bar of "Personal Achievement" as a moder.
I realy want to emphasise this. I think a lot of people making mods to create something unique, bring some mechanics that noone else think of or implement some genius gameplay system or whatever. In starcraft 1 for example someone developed a cargo-based dialogs and inventory and that was cool and interesting but also pretty simple. In starcraft 2 a lot of systems are given by default and modder need to investigate another areas where he can break the limits of the tool to impress himself and the others, because i think this exactly what makes modding fun and satisfying. And there is much harder to do so because this editor basicaly have presets for everything and your creativity is somewhat limited. You basicaly need to do a routine work within a given framework (editing data fields) instead of inventing a bicycle. But inventing your own bicycle is the main fun factor, even if it has square wheels it still cool just because it's unique.
Basicaly what i'm trying to say that some hobby-modding-oriented people would prefer to work with limited toolset and utilize that few lego bricks to create some simple but unique systems which will also satisfy their need for "Personal Achievement" in a timely manner. I think this is the main reason why some people are using wc3 editor and even sc1 editor even nowadays.
I mentioned there is another problem, siriosly problem - you can't change vision for team. All players will see each other, so u can't change it.
Pretty cool huh?
http://blog.dota2.com/2016/03/supporting-custom-game-developers/
http://www.pcgamer.com/valve-custom-game-pass-interview/
@abvdzh: Go
The sc2 editor is a professional tool that pretty much stands with software like 3dsmax, adobe illustrator or unity in terms of complexity (+/-). That tools in opposite to the game editor could provide you with a work that will give you food for life and money to pay the bills.
Anybody who has said this obviously hasn't spent any significant time in the Dota 2 workshop tools. The Starcraft II editor is BY FAR the easiest tool for RTS modding since the Warcraft III editor. You can make full fledged custom games without any knowledge of scripting, and although the data GUI is a clusterfuck it is by far less intimidating than scripting in Lua for Dota 2. The dota 2 terrain editor also requires you to subdivide quads and do a bunch of other real annoying professional shit that is simply not required in SC2. Even simple things like linking/importing assets is by far more streamlined and easy than the dota 2 tools.
Want to make building construction in dota? hope you want to create an entirely custom library, want to do resource gathering? do your own library. want to have a command card? Do it yourself.
There has been like a year and a half of development on the dotacraft library and even it feels super shitty to play and doesn't work well. Basically if you don't want to make a map that plays just like dota or something simple like a tower defense you're completely fucked. I'm pretty sure you still can't create a tilemap bigger than the default dota map without completely breaking the fog of war system.
With the amount of time and work it takes to make something in Dota 2 you might as well just become an indie developer because it's not a comprehensive tool like the SC2 editor that does a bunch of the hard legwork for you.
How is that even a question? I can create Dota2 with the SC2 editor. I can't create SC2 with the Dota2 editor. (and sometimes I can't even create SC2 in the SC2 editor^^)
@w00bz: Go
so you quoted random sentence from my post just to legitimate your shit that doesn't correspond anyhow to what i was talking about. Seems legit.
I dont see what from your post was questioned by me. So next time you want to do in-depth comparsion between d2 and sc2 modding don't put my quotations in there okay.
Hi, guys. Im creating mods for d2 about year. Have own sucsesfull published mod. Who want to join - feel free to contact me.
@abvdzh: Go
The SC2 tools in no way even compare to the difficulty associated with professional tools such as Unity, Unreal or Source. The people who say the SC2 tools are too difficult weren't serious modders in Warcraft III and really didn't spend more than a week in the sc2 editor.
Quote from Mocherad:
Hi, guys. Im creating mods for d2 about year. Have own sucsesfull published mod. Who want to join - feel free to contact me.
Your name sounds familiar. Are you related to Mozared?
@OutsiderXE:
You can saw my speed maping/level design in starcraft 2 Editor
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCenX0ffRvZ5Rc3P7nhEmXgQ
Or you can saw or heard of my warcraft 3 mod - Darechom
Anyway nothing related with Mozared, just a bit same nicknames.