Let me just quote the battle.net terms of service (link)
Quote:
11.4 User Content. “Content” means any communications, images, sounds, and all the material and information that you upload or transmit through a Game client or the Service, or that other users upload or transmit, including without limitation any chat text. You hereby grant Blizzard a perpetual, irrevocable, worldwide, paid-up, non-exclusive, license, including the right to sublicense to third parties, and right to reproduce, fix, adapt, modify, translate, reformat, create derivative works from, manufacture, introduce into circulation, publish, distribute, sell, license, sublicense, transfer, rent, lease, transmit, publicly display, publicly perform, or provide access to electronically, broadcast, communicate to the public by telecommunication, display, perform, enter into computer memory, and use and practice such Content as well as all modified and derivative works thereof. To the extent permitted by applicable laws, you hereby waive any moral rights you may have in any Content.
Specifically,
Quote:
You hereby grant Blizzard a perpetual, irrevocable, worldwide, paid-up, non-exclusive, license (...) and right to reproduce, fix, adapt, modify, translate, reformat, create derivative works from, manufacture, introduce into circulation, publish, distribute, sell, license, sublicense, transfer, rent, lease, (...) such Content as well as all modified and derivative works thereof.
In the light of the recent development of blizzard turning down users' wishes (chat channels, anyone?, Cross-region accounts?), as well as becoming overly profit-oriented, I read this passage with fear. Since with the new and wonderful Battle.net 2.0 it is no longer possible to distribute your maps by spreading it peer-to-peer, and instead only by uploading it to BNet, you willingful hand over your maps and all its content to Blizzard.
Looking for example at the most popular funmap of all time, DotA. I could well imagine Blizzard to be wanting to make profit off of it. Of other peoples' work. I am personally not sure if I would ever publish any map I've made, with the ToS in mind. Especially when you have included your own sounds, models or images.
True. But in SC and WC3, all maps were stored locally, on your computer. Map download was peer-to-peer, without BNet being involved in any way. In SC2 however, you are forced to upload every map onto BNet servers, making the passage "(...) all the material and information that you upload or transmit through a Game client or the Service (...)" applicable.
None of it was ever inapplicable to WC3/SC1. You still transmitted through the client in previous games.
People complained about it before, but Blizzard's never really abused it.
Their game, their editor, their intellectual property. They own the trademarks to everything you are buying a license to use, while you play on their servers. They reserve the right to do what they want with their property, up to and including revoking your privileges to use it whenever they want. This isn't new or specific to them. DotA used their resources too. The thing is it's in Blizzard's best interests to foster this kind of thing because there's no way they could develop the sheer amount of content that comes with custom games internally, and interest generated by fan projects feeds into their original product's longevity without any expense on their part whatsoever. They get continued publicity for their product and we get to have fun with the resources they provide us to make our ideas into new game play. It's mutually beneficial.
It's lawyer stuff to protect themselves from being sued by people. We've got some like that at Curse too:
Quote from Curse Terms of Use:
By submitting, posting or displaying User Submissions on, to, or through Curse Websites (or its successors and affiliates), you grant Curse, Inc. a worldwide, non-exclusive, transferrable, royalty-free right to use, reproduce, distribute, display, perform, make derivative works of (except with regard to Submitted Add-Ons), transmit or otherwise utilize such User Submissions on Curse Websites (or its successors and affiliates). Source
Basically if you don't put those terms you can get sued because you promote a map in the front page for example.
Blizzard terms are a lot stronger though. I guess adding all those restrictions on the ToS costs less then getting sued!
Well let me translate for you with limited knowledge in contracts and copyright. ( 3 more years of law school, when will it end?!?)
You are giving up all your content rights to Blizzard. That means right now Blizzard can reproduce DotA (wc3 content) and sell it without any authority from Eul or Icefrog. However, it does not give Blizzard exclusive right to the work. That means if you create a map, Blizzard may sell it and run away with it but Blizzard can't stop you from making a standard alone version of it (as long as you don't use Blizzard content but that's another story).
My Opinion
"To the extent permitted by applicable laws, you hereby waive any moral rights you may have in any Content."
Well... This part of the clause is not enforceable in law, unlikely anyway. The court will see the content (a map) like a "word document" (data produced by another program). To give you an example, even if microsoft word had that same clause in their EULA do you think that will be part of the actual contract? Let's say that same clause applied in all word documents and a writer used a word document to write a script for a movie named "Avatar". Will Microsoft have ownership over the script? (this is actually regarding business customs, but let's not get into that). In contracts not every clause is enforceable even you entered into an agreement. If it did and if I was Blizzard, I would have wrote in the EULA "You hereby grant Blizzard, power of attorney"
There is no precedent for this (since no company would be ridiculous enough to go to court over this).
Of course if you make a map that only consists of mostly Blizzard work, that's a different story. It would depends how much work you have put in.
They made the ToS so that it gives Blizzard "the right" to stop, reject and control all user created contents. Blizzard do not have ownership over them. Also it gives them right to pursue anyone who wrongfully use the user created content.
This is for Korean ToS only although they are still violating copyright laws in other countries too (same laws for any country that signed the international copyright laws).
Something the TL OP didnt' mention
게임내에서 보여지지 않고 게임과 일체화되지 않은 귀하의 이용자 콘텐츠 (예컨대, 일반게시판등에의 게시물)에 대하여는 블리자드가 귀하의 명시적인 동의가 없이 상업적으로 이용하지 않으며, 귀하는 언제든지 이러한 이용자 콘텐츠를 삭제할 수 있습니다.
다만, 이러한 이용이 법률에 의하여 제한을 받을 경우, 블리자드는 해당 법률 규정에 따릅니다.
There is no more "moral right waiving". Blizzard may delete any user content and people to have follow the general law regarding user contents (possibly to prevent replays/user maps being sold illegally).
Also, it's incredibly unlikely that Blizzard takes aim at your map. I think most of those fears stem from the delusion that people at Blizzard care about you and your map in particular among the sea of custom maps that only signify one thing to them: +X boxes sold to people looking to play UMS/Dota = €60X profit. What those maps actually look like is irrelevant to them, unless it has a swear word in it and someone might commit suicide because of that and sue Blizzard.
Well it is their servers, their game. It is a bit unfortunate though, the new turn blizzard is taking with starcraft. They made so many f*cktons of money with WOW that their business model has completely changed throughout the company. SCII simply wouldn't have been worth making unless they created surefire ways of perpetual income. Manhandleing custom content is one such way to ensure they control what you can play or not, not get anything too good for free. They need to be in control of what you play or people hack the system and play things for free (which was good advertising back in the day but nowadays it eats up potential profit through mass pirating).
Simply put the times are achangin, in some ways for the good, and in some ways for the bad. As a map designer I'm stoked at the possibility of MAYBE making money off a mod, as a gamer I'm a bit jaded by all corporate BS finding its way into my favorite past-time.
this terrifies me. i am going to make maps regardless, but i will NEVER, and i mean NEVER upload or play one online. and THAT, is why im a perpetual winner-
When you submit a map, blizzard actually has the right to walk into your front door and sh*t in your kitchen, it's pretty bad. And that's if you submit a good map and they like you.
It's not a stretch to think that what blizzard will do is pay map designers in blizzard bucks. It's doubtful they will pay in real money. They will then sell the maps in blizzard bucks much like xbox live blocks work so that you pay for more than you need. It hooks in nice with real id now too. So you will be able to see what custom maps your friends are playing on. For those that are thinking well i will just download my maps from fileplanet they will simple hook a map id to your account so it wont matter if the map is stored client side or not.
I like the game alot. But there is no way that they can allow 600,000+ people world wide to not be on the hook for more money. I guess it will come down to how much they sell the maps for but I would be deluded to think that I wont be spending money on maps sooner or later. I am sure they have the scheme all written in stone but are waiting to spring it until after box sales and maybe a few months after. The drug dealer introduction works.
The funny thing is though once people buy the game unlike a monthly sub game they really wont give a shit if people leave any money made on maps is bonus and they already took you for box what do they care. I just find it SAD really that people that avoided most of the WoW rollercoaster are still praising Blizzard like it was the company of 10 years ago.
If anyone of you think premium maps will be a success, then you are dead wrong. No one is going to buy maps. Dont dream on it.
Intial success no. 3mos later when they decide not to make anymore regular flavored ones yuppers. Custom maps wont even have to be policed if they do it right simply pay people in in-game currency. If someone buys a busted map they report it and offending map is inspected if busted. Map is removed creator has his map making rights removed. Purchaser gets in-game currency credited. Maps will be ranked and maybe they have to deal a bit on the price at first but once it catches on it will be either buy them or don't play.
There is a bright side though which people that aren't cross genre players don't see and that is your game play hasn't been ruined in order to make money. It still RTS it still requires skill those that have been doing them for ever will be better than those that haven't and that is an incredible BRIGHT SIDE and hopefully something they don't find a work around for so they can appeal to a bigger audience you know like 5yos.
If I upload a map onto Blizzard's servers I want control of whether or not it's a "premium" map and if it were a premium map I want control over how much it costs. Should that be a concern to me?
I also want to own my original content. Even if Blizzard doesn't have exclusive rights to my work, I'm not ok with Blizzard "stealing it and running away with it." What does that mean anyway? Could they make derivative works from it? Right now, could Blizzard make a stand alone "DotA 2" without any permission given from Eul or Icefrog? Let's assume that DotA was completely original content and didn't borrow from the Warcraft Universe, how about then? I'm not asking if the wording in the EULA technically gives them this right, I'm asking if it should be a concern that Blizzard actually might consider it if they thought they'd make some money off of it.
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Let me just quote the battle.net terms of service (link)
Specifically,
In the light of the recent development of blizzard turning down users' wishes (chat channels, anyone?, Cross-region accounts?), as well as becoming overly profit-oriented, I read this passage with fear. Since with the new and wonderful Battle.net 2.0 it is no longer possible to distribute your maps by spreading it peer-to-peer, and instead only by uploading it to BNet, you willingful hand over your maps and all its content to Blizzard.
Looking for example at the most popular funmap of all time, DotA. I could well imagine Blizzard to be wanting to make profit off of it. Of other peoples' work. I am personally not sure if I would ever publish any map I've made, with the ToS in mind. Especially when you have included your own sounds, models or images.
So guys, am I overreacting? What do you think?
It was like this in SC1 and WC3, just btw. Exact same language.
True. But in SC and WC3, all maps were stored locally, on your computer. Map download was peer-to-peer, without BNet being involved in any way. In SC2 however, you are forced to upload every map onto BNet servers, making the passage "(...) all the material and information that you upload or transmit through a Game client or the Service (...)" applicable.
@frostmanx: Go
None of it was ever inapplicable to WC3/SC1. You still transmitted through the client in previous games.
People complained about it before, but Blizzard's never really abused it.
@frostmanx: Go
If I was Blizzard, I'd do the same thing. This has already been posted all over the SC2 Beta forum.
Their game, their editor, their intellectual property. They own the trademarks to everything you are buying a license to use, while you play on their servers. They reserve the right to do what they want with their property, up to and including revoking your privileges to use it whenever they want. This isn't new or specific to them. DotA used their resources too. The thing is it's in Blizzard's best interests to foster this kind of thing because there's no way they could develop the sheer amount of content that comes with custom games internally, and interest generated by fan projects feeds into their original product's longevity without any expense on their part whatsoever. They get continued publicity for their product and we get to have fun with the resources they provide us to make our ideas into new game play. It's mutually beneficial.
It's lawyer stuff to protect themselves from being sued by people. We've got some like that at Curse too:
Basically if you don't put those terms you can get sued because you promote a map in the front page for example.
Blizzard terms are a lot stronger though. I guess adding all those restrictions on the ToS costs less then getting sued!
Well let me translate for you with limited knowledge in contracts and copyright. ( 3 more years of law school, when will it end?!?)
You are giving up all your content rights to Blizzard. That means right now Blizzard can reproduce DotA (wc3 content) and sell it without any authority from Eul or Icefrog. However, it does not give Blizzard exclusive right to the work. That means if you create a map, Blizzard may sell it and run away with it but Blizzard can't stop you from making a standard alone version of it (as long as you don't use Blizzard content but that's another story).
My Opinion
"To the extent permitted by applicable laws, you hereby waive any moral rights you may have in any Content."
Well... This part of the clause is not enforceable in law, unlikely anyway. The court will see the content (a map) like a "word document" (data produced by another program). To give you an example, even if microsoft word had that same clause in their EULA do you think that will be part of the actual contract? Let's say that same clause applied in all word documents and a writer used a word document to write a script for a movie named "Avatar". Will Microsoft have ownership over the script? (this is actually regarding business customs, but let's not get into that). In contracts not every clause is enforceable even you entered into an agreement. If it did and if I was Blizzard, I would have wrote in the EULA "You hereby grant Blizzard, power of attorney"
There is no precedent for this (since no company would be ridiculous enough to go to court over this).
Of course if you make a map that only consists of mostly Blizzard work, that's a different story. It would depends how much work you have put in.
Double posting time!
Well new information
They made the ToS so that it gives Blizzard "the right" to stop, reject and control all user created contents. Blizzard do not have ownership over them. Also it gives them right to pursue anyone who wrongfully use the user created content.
This is for Korean ToS only although they are still violating copyright laws in other countries too (same laws for any country that signed the international copyright laws).
More information here
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=132008
Something the TL OP didnt' mention
게임내에서 보여지지 않고 게임과 일체화되지 않은 귀하의 이용자 콘텐츠 (예컨대, 일반게시판등에의 게시물)에 대하여는 블리자드가 귀하의 명시적인 동의가 없이 상업적으로 이용하지 않으며, 귀하는 언제든지 이러한 이용자 콘텐츠를 삭제할 수 있습니다.
다만, 이러한 이용이 법률에 의하여 제한을 받을 경우, 블리자드는 해당 법률 규정에 따릅니다.
There is no more "moral right waiving". Blizzard may delete any user content and people to have follow the general law regarding user contents (possibly to prevent replays/user maps being sold illegally).
Can't stress this enough FOR KOREAN ToS ONLY!
Also, it's incredibly unlikely that Blizzard takes aim at your map. I think most of those fears stem from the delusion that people at Blizzard care about you and your map in particular among the sea of custom maps that only signify one thing to them: +X boxes sold to people looking to play UMS/Dota = €60X profit. What those maps actually look like is irrelevant to them, unless it has a swear word in it and someone might commit suicide because of that and sue Blizzard.
Just relax, even if blizzard makes a profit, (yea the marketplace) you'll end up earning too, in a way you wouldn't be able to without this system.
Well it is their servers, their game. It is a bit unfortunate though, the new turn blizzard is taking with starcraft. They made so many f*cktons of money with WOW that their business model has completely changed throughout the company. SCII simply wouldn't have been worth making unless they created surefire ways of perpetual income. Manhandleing custom content is one such way to ensure they control what you can play or not, not get anything too good for free. They need to be in control of what you play or people hack the system and play things for free (which was good advertising back in the day but nowadays it eats up potential profit through mass pirating).
Simply put the times are achangin, in some ways for the good, and in some ways for the bad. As a map designer I'm stoked at the possibility of MAYBE making money off a mod, as a gamer I'm a bit jaded by all corporate BS finding its way into my favorite past-time.
this terrifies me. i am going to make maps regardless, but i will NEVER, and i mean NEVER upload or play one online. and THAT, is why im a perpetual winner-
I'm fine with this.. absolutely as long as it doesn't deter-ate the funness of my maps AND I get credit.
When you submit a map, blizzard actually has the right to walk into your front door and sh*t in your kitchen, it's pretty bad. And that's if you submit a good map and they like you.
It's not a stretch to think that what blizzard will do is pay map designers in blizzard bucks. It's doubtful they will pay in real money. They will then sell the maps in blizzard bucks much like xbox live blocks work so that you pay for more than you need. It hooks in nice with real id now too. So you will be able to see what custom maps your friends are playing on. For those that are thinking well i will just download my maps from fileplanet they will simple hook a map id to your account so it wont matter if the map is stored client side or not.
I like the game alot. But there is no way that they can allow 600,000+ people world wide to not be on the hook for more money. I guess it will come down to how much they sell the maps for but I would be deluded to think that I wont be spending money on maps sooner or later. I am sure they have the scheme all written in stone but are waiting to spring it until after box sales and maybe a few months after. The drug dealer introduction works.
The funny thing is though once people buy the game unlike a monthly sub game they really wont give a shit if people leave any money made on maps is bonus and they already took you for box what do they care. I just find it SAD really that people that avoided most of the WoW rollercoaster are still praising Blizzard like it was the company of 10 years ago.
@frostmanx: Go
If anyone of you think premium maps will be a success, then you are dead wrong. No one is going to buy maps. Dont dream on it.
Intial success no. 3mos later when they decide not to make anymore regular flavored ones yuppers. Custom maps wont even have to be policed if they do it right simply pay people in in-game currency. If someone buys a busted map they report it and offending map is inspected if busted. Map is removed creator has his map making rights removed. Purchaser gets in-game currency credited. Maps will be ranked and maybe they have to deal a bit on the price at first but once it catches on it will be either buy them or don't play.
There is a bright side though which people that aren't cross genre players don't see and that is your game play hasn't been ruined in order to make money. It still RTS it still requires skill those that have been doing them for ever will be better than those that haven't and that is an incredible BRIGHT SIDE and hopefully something they don't find a work around for so they can appeal to a bigger audience you know like 5yos.
If I upload a map onto Blizzard's servers I want control of whether or not it's a "premium" map and if it were a premium map I want control over how much it costs. Should that be a concern to me?
I also want to own my original content. Even if Blizzard doesn't have exclusive rights to my work, I'm not ok with Blizzard "stealing it and running away with it." What does that mean anyway? Could they make derivative works from it? Right now, could Blizzard make a stand alone "DotA 2" without any permission given from Eul or Icefrog? Let's assume that DotA was completely original content and didn't borrow from the Warcraft Universe, how about then? I'm not asking if the wording in the EULA technically gives them this right, I'm asking if it should be a concern that Blizzard actually might consider it if they thought they'd make some money off of it.