SC2Mapster

Hi guys,

I apparently don't fully understand how the relationship between armor and damage work. Here's what I think:

If a unit is being attacked and has 0 armor, and the attacking unit does 100 damage, the attacked unit takes 100 damage. If a unit is being attacked and has 100 armor, the attacked unit takes 0 damage.

Is this at all correct? It seems to work like this sometimes, and other times it doesn't.

Here an example:

I have a unit that uses upgrades to armor. Level 3 upgrades go up to 98 so in total the unit can have 100 upgrades. At 100 upgrades, the unit has 500 armor. So, with the unit (marine) at 50 armor, and Kerrigan(Tyrador) at 50 damage psi-blast, the marine takes 50 damage every 3 or 4 attacks. At 0 armor, the marine takes 50 damage almost every attack. How is this determined? This makes it very hard to balance.

On another, more annoying note: How can I get Odin to attack Zerglings? I have looked everywhere in the data module and can't find anything that would keep him from doing so.

Thanks in advance!!

Every Damage-type effect has a reduction of damage per point of armor. Most attacks have 1 there, most spells have 0.

Furthermore, there's a global "minimum damage" setting that's 1 to default. If left unchanged, no unit can take less than 1 damage to an attack.

The global minimum damage is .5 by default, not one. There are four types of damage, melee, ranged, spell, and splash. They are essentially arbitrary, but have filtering effects on certain abilities. The immortal's shield does not reduce spell damage, such as from psionic storm or yamato gun. The sentry's shield only reduces ranged damage by 2. There is also an armor multiplier on every damage effect, the default is 1 for melee range and splash damage, aka, every point of armor reduces damage by 1. On spells its zero, so every point of armor doesn't do anything. What type of damage does your kerrigan do?

@SkeletalHammer: Go

The psi blast is ranged and the talons are melee. I am currently playing around with the values. It seems to me that when a nuke is launched, the units are completely vulnerable, as well as when they are moving. Is this true?

The amount of damage reduced per armor point is set at each individual damage effect. If you created new damage effects, you probably didn't do that.

Quote:

So, with the unit (marine) at 50 armor, and Kerrigan(Tyrador) at 50 damage psi-blast, the marine takes 50 damage every 3 or 4 attacks. At 0 armor, the marine takes 50 damage almost every attack. How is this determined? This makes it very hard to balance.

So it takes sometimes 50 damage and sometimes none? Example map, please ;)

Quote:

On another, more annoying note: How can I get Odin to attack Zerglings? I have looked everywhere in the data module and can't find anything that would keep him from doing so.

My odin attacks zerglings just fine.

@Kueken531: Go

Well, I wanted to do a new map to show you what I mean, and apparently on my real map, things are a bit screwy. No big deal. On the new map, these are the things I changed:

Marine: Max Life - 1000 Life - 1000 Armor - 500

Kerrigan Tyrador: Invulnerable check removed Psi Blast - 50damage

Interestingly, the Marine takes the full damage. Shouldn't he take reduced damage due to 500 armor? I am confused.

I also added an Odin and some zerglings. He attacks and kills them fine. On my real map he attacks them but doesn't kill them. I think I need to take a closer look at the data.

If you still want to see test map, let me know.

"Interestingly, the Marine takes the full damage. Shouldn't he take reduced damage due to 500 armor? " Ofc full damage. Marine don't reduce spell damage from Psi Blast.

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Is the damage from the Talons also spell damage? He takes full damage from those too.

Quote from StragusMapster: Go

Every Damage-type effect has a reduction of damage per point of armor. Most attacks have 1 there, most spells have 0.

Quote from SkeletalHammer: Go

There are four types of damage, melee, ranged, spell, and splash. They are essentially arbitrary, but have filtering effects on certain abilities.
...
There is also an armor multiplier on every damage effect, the default is 1 for melee range and splash damage, aka, every point of armor reduces damage by 1. On spells its zero, so every point of armor doesn't do anything. What type of damage does your kerrigan do?

Quote from Kueken531: Go

The amount of damage reduced per armor point is set at each individual damage effect. If you created new damage effects, you probably didn't do that.

They are absolutely correct. I'm starting to have a feeling that you ignore the most important part of what we're trying to tell you.
Go to Kerrigans weapon which pierces armor, select its damage effect and check its "Armor Reduction" field. If it's 0 then damage will ignore armor. If its 1 then each point of armor will subtract 1 point from damage (as already has been stated 3 times). And that really seems to be your issue to be honest :l

Quote from Faust7777: Go

...the marine takes 50 damage every 3 or 4 attacks. At 0 armor, the marine takes 50 damage almost every attack. How is this determined? This makes it very hard to balance.

On another, more annoying note: How can I get Odin to attack Zerglings? I have looked everywhere in the data module and can't find anything that would keep him from doing so.

And these two.. just seems that you did something wrong. And there can be multiple things that you did wrong, so guessing is probably not an option. You probably should either figure it out yourself by comparing your data with original data, or post the map.

@DrSuperEvil: Go

I have been testing the last few days and I think something is just screwy. When I create a new map just for these tests, then everything works as described. :\ Sorry about the confusion guys and thanks a ton for your help. Now that I am a little more proficient with the data editor, I hope to not make mistakes like this in the future.