SC2Mapster

its an awesome map but i would like something to heal me

because when you have moderate to low hp there is almost no possibility to get it back up maybe a healing function on the CC's with like 200/200 energy? for 200-300 spice

and a healing special attack that would cost 500 energy and heals 500?

or a shield recharger that way the health damage would be avoided but the shield would be easily replaced

oh and i missed a victory condition i roflstomped everyone and no score screen :(

also a bigger map would be nice

and maybe some small units that could harass that way you could make the battlecruiser the ''omg i gotta get out unit and the smaller units just small harass with a maximum of 5 units

and i was also thinking of some interceptor ability just like the carrier it would give an additional attack and would cost like 3000 just as the laser

but keep up the good work hope my ideas could help making this awesome map even more awesome

I tried Battlecruiser Wars, but i have an issue : most of the options and buttons show weird code. Here is a screenshot : Link

I play with the french client of SC2 btw, i don't know if thats the reason.

I wanted to make some comments based on a few games since the update.

1. Hooray for Laser Beam finally working! I haven't had enough games to yet determine whether it's appropriately priced. I can say I've seen it makes a significant difference when a player does have it, so I'm inclined to say it's looking well priced.
2. Feedback I'm still disinclined to use. The one time I really used it, it was really just a 'win more'. I was already in control of the game, it just helped me close it out faster. When I tried to force myself to use it, I found I couldn't effectively because my mana was too consumed in other matters. And it was not beneficial to burn an opponent's energy either because they did not have great excess either.
3. The 20 second cooldown on warp has definitely made me more choosy on how and when I use it. And I'm glad to find myself wanting the speed upgrade. I still disagree with the need for an energy cost. I think it's an unnecessary penalty on players that are trying to create action or are being forced to defend on multiple fronts.
4. I have yet to find it necessary or beneficial to upgrade turrets. I think it's actually a disservice to newer players to give them the impression that they can turtle in.
5. I have also yet to see good reason to upgrade refineries either. I haven't taken the time to calculate how much an upgrade it is though. But unless it's very significant, I would rather invest that spice in my ability to take more islands to increase my own income and rob my opponents of theirs.
6. I did also notice the increased range for building turrets, which allows for placement in front of refineries. I am personally saddened at the loss of what I considered a great tactical element of the game.
7. I actually like that there can be no allied victory. I don't want to see it just be about who gets the better allies.

This map is a nice concept but it always boils down to the same ending. The players that ally each other kill everyone else. Then the player who had the most spice bases throughout the alliance wins. Or the player who avoided confrontation the most during the alliance wins. Any unallied player is screwed (exceptions happen of course, but amongst players of equal familiarity with the game this is the case).

Pretty much joining an alliance and letting the ally take the blunt of the damage is the key to victory.

I think this game would work better as a set team game or a set FFA game. Being able to form and break alliances is a nice idea, but it ruins the game balance.

The map itself is awesome though so props!

Hi, just want to report that FFA isn't fixed yet in v2.0. Also, the victory conditions still aren't set. Even after defeating the other team, the game still doesn't end.

Drones are fine. They get eaten easily by fungus and at half the energy cost. And when someone spams 3-4 of them I lol as my one fungus kills them all.

Yeah, you need to either remove point drones are fucking lower the energy of the BCs. Its fucking stupid and why you havent seen this yet is pure incompetence of making maps. Jesus its a fucking joke how many drones you can put down.

I created an account just so I could post on this thread. I love this custom map. You have done an awesome job.

I completely agree with Shadetee with regards to the Yamato/Warp combo. I think it's perfect as is. You have to know when to use it. Often times when near endgame I will push someone's base, they will blink in to defend, I yamato them, they start to yamato and I blink to another base to attack. Pure strategy that works impressively well.

Additionally, I rarely use Yamato. I focus on other things such as map control and getting as much spice as I can. Usually I can control more than 50% of the map, and eventually win by picking my fights.

Edit: As for the comment below, I think 500 mana is plenty. There are some people that use yamato like candy and they run out of energy way before endgame. And 3 or 4 levels of attack is critical to taking out enemy bases rapidly.

i honestly think yamato cannon spamming needs to be changed. 500 minerals for a 750 dmg atk that has no cool down doesnt make sense when upgrade bc atk cost 250 just for extra 5 damage.

give yamato a cooldown after each use or increase the energy required to use it.

I really think there's already a great balance in place, and I wouldn't mess with things too much in one go.

The major things I would address are: the warp cooldown (I'm thinking 20 seconds would work well) Feedback (I like the drain cap idea, to make the ability far less OP and can bring down it's costs. Cooldown will be required as well) Laser Beam (still not working, and honestly if it's not an easy fix I'd just get rid of it - the game works well without it) HP Regen (perhaps an innate regen, and upgrade increases the regen?) Alliances (I think a global notice announcing any alliances made or broken would allow players the ability to better manage themselves.)

The people QQing over Yamato warp dodge are too locked in the mindset that it's Battlecruisers so Yamato has to be the best thing ever. Yamato is a high risk maneuver that can yield great results or leave you in the dust. The key is knowing when to use it.

I highly disagree with the need for turrets to upgrade. They are very effective deterrents during early and mid game. Late game they lose their effectiveness and allow for the game to actually end. I would hate to see this game degenerate to turret-turtle defense. Even with over-armor each volley still does 1 damage, and at that late stage of the game every damage counts.

So far I am absolutely loving it, been playing non stop for the last 2 days. But there needs to be a few changes for sure. Firstly I know your latest update says it fixed the additional weapon upgrade, but as far as I can tell it does nothing. It made no difference to actually attacking a target (not to mention it physically showed no difference, no additional icons, data, or graphics to display the upgrade). So perhaps the easiest way to do this upgrade would be to actually have the upgrade change the amount of attacks the battle cruiser gets, i.e it starts with 2 attacks, so the upgrade makes it 3, next makes it 4, and so on and so fourth.

Also. Some games seem more stalemate because either the BC's of the remaining players are so damaged no one dares enter combat or assault an island OR they are so teched up that they simply attack the Command center directly ignoring other BCs or towers. So there needs to be some remedies.

My suggestions. Upgrades:

Turrets need to be able to upgrade, BC's can upgrade till turrets are basically useless. So add some upgrades that allow them to have increased damage. I do agree that there health should never upgrade beyond what a yomato attack can kill, so the upgrades should only up the damage not the health. However I do think that all three structures, Turret, command center and refinery should all have a shield upgrade. The turret because of the yomato restriction should only add 250 shields (750 total health combined so that yomato can still kill).

The command Center should be able to have the same Shields added that the BCs have as well (each base upgraded individually however, not a cross the board tech upgrade) This goes for the refineries as well.

Also the Command Center AND the refineries should have weapon attachment upgrades, allowing them to fight back when they are under attack. As it is right now, if you have your weapons on the BC upgraded to deal 100 damage then you can run into someones island throwing up a couple missile deterrents and target ONLY the Command center and you take out the island in just a few milliseconds above 3 seconds. Wiping out all there turrets/refineries in the process. So all one needs to do to insure a quick win is to upgrade weapons alone to 100 damage and get the missile deterrents.

Lastly I need to touch on the Shields and health of the BCs. In longer games the shields and health become so low on BC's that they no longer jump into battle with other BC's or even islands for fear of dieing from a single Yomato attack or something else. So Leave the upgrades and health/shields recharge rate the same. But add tier levels to them. Nothing super drastic. But the way it is now, I have to sit back for 30 minutes just to recover enough health to withstand a Yomato attack or two. So Allow additional upgrade levels to both the health regen, and shield regen (shield regen upgrade past level 1, could add 5 shield armor and +1 regen rate, but no extra shields)

I know I have more to say but I need to go play a few more times to remember it all.

I don't think there needs to be an energy cost w/ warp. If you're being forced to jump all over the map to defend against mutiple players, you're going to blow through your energy using other abilities anyways. The center player already has it bad enough, no need to penalize him any more. I really think the cast time is unnecessary as well. With an increased cooldown on warp, there's plenty of opportunity to get in a yamato or two. But there's still the risk factor that you're going to waste your energy on a vacant target.

I actually find missile turrets very effective as deterrents and I think they're very well balanced. Yes, once you're armored up they barely touch you, but that really helps allow for the game to end. I use them greatly when defending an island, as well, to help eat up my opponent's drone energy. Their range is perfect; that at their outmost placement it still allows a player to harass an island by taking out geysers with some precision flying. Plus with an increased warp cooldown, turrets will be important to slow down your enemy's assault on your island. I might say, throw some armor on them so they're harder to destroy with auto-attack but they should still be 1-shot with yamato.

I do understand how people get frustrated in the mid-game when they feel like they can't effectively do anything until they've teched up. But this is a subtle area that seperates the upper tier players from the rest. Mid game is all about attrition. Hit and runs on geysers to mess with your opponent's spice generation and also forcing them to replace them. And having them expend resources on turrets as well.

so, for some odd reason, I find this simple little map, awkwardly amusing. My brother and I teamed up and started playing some games and it just wouldn't stop. So, might I say, nice job at breaking the constant "All there is, is Nexus war crap".

Now for the critique.

The map is simple, I get this. So, the critique I'm offering is simply out've my opinion; though hopefully some what educated.

5 Players seems a bit, "huh?" for a game that lets you ally at will. There is always an oddman out that just gets ROFLstomped by usually, 2 teams made up of the other 4. Increase the amount of players, and preferably, make it even.

The game loses it's steam after about the 7th base. This is partly because there might not be enough abilities to really separate the generic issues we're facing at the moment. Combat really starts to jump up after a commonly used build/upgrades are obtained to a bunch of some what dull grinds. i feel its largely due to the abilities we have available. More on that below.

As Shadetee mentioned, Buildings burning kind'a blows. It's a factor out've control to the players in anyway. HOWEVER, it sadly, does actually allow the only real flip up available after that 7th base rush. You can either due the standard spell combo, or go in with nicely upgraded weapons and hit and run with Warp. Lighting up the structures really screws with the enemy. I'd possibly consider this when contimplating what to do about the burning thing. I found it to be a cool strat; however cheap.

Abilities need a lot of balancing. All abilities and upgrade should be some what useful in some way. However, I generally never see most of them. BC speed is rather pointless because of Warp. Warp is extremely flexible in the game. Usually, within the first 3 bases, you'll have Warp because it helps you Cap more, faster. Fungal Growth is like a free shot that out does Yamato, hard. Yamato is dodgable by Warp jumps, while FG isn't. Also, the energy vs damage ratio is insanely in FGs favor. FG being AoE? Also helps vs mass PDDs. PDDs, if they aren't FGed, nullify using Armor Regen. Further more, if you with to save some energy, The Shield grants you a 2.5k pool with free regen essentially. And lastly, Feedback is WAY to costly, You never use it, even with the Energy Regen upgrade. Weapon stacking gets NASTY vs buildings. Coupled with the easy to achieve Warp, and you the next generation Reaver Shuttle.

Missile Turrets are absolutely Worthless. There is NO need to build them. Their missiles are nerfed with the drone, and Yamatos one shot them. Besides that, the CCs only have 200% more HP, so simply popping a drone and raping it with 3 Yamatos or blasting it with stacked weapons ups destroys the whole base.

My suggestions Crank up the concept a notch. Make a larger map, and use triggers to have the islands spawn in random locations. Also, the map giving an option to be either explored, or unexplored would be nice. The unexplored option would change the game state in the early for some more interesting social interactions XD Up the players to 8. Possible to have a MCC style? Maybe a cap of 3 to 5 cruisers? Multiple cruiser choices?

I relize the last 2 would add to the complexity, but, I'm just sayin'. The map really starts to remind me of a table top game; if only it allowed fleets.

Going to give my opinions on Buswolley's points since he made such a well thought out post.

Alliance system is fine as long as players aren't idiots. But that's tough when dealing with a bunch of noobs who don't know how to politic war games. For a better balance for most players, I agree that locked 2v2 or FFA is better. But I'd like to give an example of good handling of the alliance system.

I had a game where 3 of us were playing solo and 2 players had allied. Myself and another 'table-talked' and allied to eliminate the players who had allied. While we were doing the work to handle them, the 5th player was sitting back and claiming the empty islands after we had killed one of the partners. After we eliminated the 2nd partner, it was clear that the 5th player was far better positioned; having more health, more islands, and more upgrades. True to our words, myself and my partner broke our alliance but we punched the 5th from two sides knowing it was in both our best interests. When the 5th seemed about broken, my former ally and I started jabbing at each other knowing that we would have to deal with each other eventually. It was a great struggle and was pure wargaming at its best.

Warping I really don't have a problem with. While yes, it does make it easier to hold multiple footholds it is still disadvantageous to spread out. If you secure a section of the map, it is unlikely that someone will attempt to assault your deeper islands. Thereby you need invest less turrets to defend. And if you're really being pelted on a lot of fronts, your warp cooldown can't keep you everywhere. I think a compromise may be to increase the cooldown of warp. As it stands, I rarely upgrade cruiser speed as warp will get me around sufficiently most of the time.

I do however find the request for 'spell resistance' unnecessary. As you said yourself, warp allows a player to escape a yamato. If someone manages to land a yamato blast they deserve to do a solid boat of damage. Yamato is very effective for an aggressor. The opposing player will likely warp in to defend their island leaving them on cooldown so you can blast them with a yamato. What warp can't escape is a Fungal Growth, and is very effective against someone who's hitting and running on you. Even though they can warp out, they still take the full fungal damage.

I would like to see the buildings not burn down. It's frustrating when you successfully defend an assault only to watch your island be lost to burning. A minor regen on them would be nice, like zerg buildings but no quick fixes. Attrition is also an important element to war games.

I also agree that there needs to be a better way to regain health. If two players engage too early, they just end up wearing each other down that they put themselves out of the game. But every CC being able to heal would just increase the win-more slope of being in control. I would suggest something like if you control 4 or fewer islands, you get a regen that stacks with the regen upgrade.

Feedback was definitely far too strong before but got over nerfed and is now completely useless. Not only is it a huge investment of spice, but also requires so much energy that you'll never actually get a chance to use it. I think capping the energy drain (maybe 100?), and placing a cooldown on the ability (20 seconds?) can easily get it in line so that it's still useful and highly popular without being overpowering. Perhaps an equal 100 energy to use would be balanced?

Currently, I am finding the victory trigger to be broken, not just for allied victory but for individual as well. Also, I am still not seeing Laser Beam working still.

This game challenges players with simple basics that are difficult to master, and it makes for a refreshing custom that's not just another lame tug. Some feedback:

- I abuse the hell out of the alliance system. In FFA, there's really no downside to just sending an alliance request to everyone in the game. When they all inevitably accept, I can see everything and just help some of them pick off the ones in weaker positions. And if those alliances pose a problem, I can shake them off whenever I like. Remove the alliance system and make it either straight FFA or 2v2. If you have to keep the alliance system, restrict it a little: limit the number of alliances one player can have, or make them semipermanent.

- Cut the 5th player. The four players in the four corners makes lots of sense, and often the 5th person somewhere in the middle gets fucked fast.

- Warp really needs some restrictions. Zone control poses strategic questions of positioning: stacking islands next to each other should make more sense than going for faraway resorts. And it sorta does, but Warp makes it really damn easy to maintain a spread-out empire, which should be the hard part of controlling lots of islands. Battlecruiser speed also ought to be reduced; it makes managing spread islands too easy even without Warp.

- Warp can also be used to dodge Yamato, saving the warper from 700+ damage, and wasting 500 energy from the enemy. At the very least, Warp needs a cast time equal to Yamato's: but probably a good deal longer, and with a more substantial cooldown, if it stays in the game at all. Warp should pose a strategic choice. It also trivializes Fungal Growth, since you can just use it while stuck. Growth should possibly disable Warp (but give Growth a cooldown, too: else, you can just lock someone down on Growth all day.)

- Allow players to invest in some kind of spell resistance. Right now it's possible to armor up and tank out a lot of gunfire, but Yamato still hurts like hell and it feels like a lot of good armor money went for nothing.

- Dear god, increase regen rates and maybe give command centers healing/energy regen abilities. That stuff takes way too long. You could also give players more levels of Regenerative Steel, but make each level cheaper: giving them yet another investment choice. Just make sure whatever you do, regen is increased across the board. Or give them some healing options back at home base.

- I'd like to see some Gold Geysers, maybe in the corners or in the center of the map. Right now everything feels equally important and it might be fun to spice things up a bit, pun intended.