Even after the dramatic discussion I decided to continue the project. It does not really matter if I get everything I want in to the game. Ill just do my best to deliver a good gaming experience.
Progress:
4 classes, each with 9 unique spells. Classes are: fire, lightning, poison and ice. The general functionality is ready. I still need to modify them a bit to make the spell interaction work. I would like to expand each class to 12 spells, but I find it rather hard to come up with ideas. So 9 it is for now...
Base questing system and NPC interaction. I will most likely gategorize the quests by Main, Personal and Event. You can have 1 of each active at same time. Event quests might be removed though....Ill just have to see.
Modified boss AI a bit. Bosses now use spells more randomly, so experience should be a bit different most of the time. I will have to test out how it feels.
Added new areas
PvP added
Base UI modified a bit
It will still be a while before next test. I might also expand 4 active skills to 5 and perhaps even increase player limit. 6-8 would be a good number, but increasing player limit might cause some problems too...
As one could expect making RPG takes so much time. Just making the basic systems takes time and I just get feeling of it not going anywhere -_-.
And there is much to think about. How to handle the leveling and questing...
Currently Im leaning towards one main quest and you can have multiple personal quests. And the main quest can be done by leveling up or following the story...(so you can kind of decide what style you want to play, even though its still actiong RPG).
Leveling will most likely affect your health,mana and spellpower. You can currently have 1 element you want to learn but I could do something like you could pick elements when you level up (more same type elements give you better spells on the elemental trees). But I might just go with level up and equipment affect your spellpower....
Hope red "close window" cross will have a hotkey, otherwise it has to be 100 times larger, because it's a torture to press 10 times a minute a button which is smaller then the cursor.
New versions is out! (If you want to test throw me a PM, its again open secret beta).
Published on EU
Test version includes
4 classes
storyline, improved boss battles
3 bosses to fight
shops, items, equipment (if you feel like gathering stuff)
Generally this could be a style I would go with the map. I might change few stuff, but lets first see what people think of it....
I have not tested it in multiplayer at all. So I would appriciate if someone would try to test with couple of people, allthough it supports 1-4 players.
After this I might take a break though. Fixing and making the basic stuff was kinda consuming...but I tend to get obsessed on something like getting a decent test version out.
Forgot to add arena observation, Ill add it later
If you have played before, create new char cause old ones will be somewhat bugged.
Alright, finally got to play :D
If you count this as preview to where things are going I can say we're gonna have ourselves a sweet map in the future.
Things that bothered me:
-unexpectedly high damage. I think I start with 450 health thinking that I'm pretty durable and then see my health drop rapidly as I take any damage. And then I go to jungle and see that zerglings do 10 dmg with cooldown of 0.1 sec.. yay for 100 dps zerglings :D (But I like it. Makes me want to get that armor + I like punishing monsters.. It's just that it's rather unexpected and makes me go wtf when I loose 300 hp just cause I that cute looking small zergling get close to me);
-would be cool to know how much dmg hydra spit does since it's basically hydras only weapon;
-I can't seem to go back to starting area (where Mercury is) once I move out of it (warp screen doesn't work?);
-Would like it to be more obvious where I can warp between screens. It's not intuitive at all for Starcraft Map (At least for general warps. You can keep secret areas not indicated(what am I talking, that is the point of secret areas.. and you're gonna have them, right?);
-Next wave in arena seem to delay/not start when there are many powerups left from previous round;
-Queen boss burrowcharged into bottom-left gate and I never saw her again.. had to end my game there since there was no way out.
And now for some useless nitpicking since I can :P
-sudden spawns in wilds with no indication that they're coming to warn player;
-Healthbars for invincible units confuse me;
-sad that can only purchase 250 health potion;
-dialogs :D
Also about story.. I'm not sure but I think mixing starcraft names and magick/rpg ruins it for me. Pretty much zero immersion. Also the intro text makes me think I'm playing children tea-party simulator. It's a gladiator realm where men fight to death for gold and glory. Why am I greeted with such friendly and happy atmosphere? This map needs more manliness >.>
And I rally enjoyed playing it in singleplayer, not sure if the same would apply to multiplayer. In SP I can just go chill while killing zerglings in the wilds. In multiplayer I feel players need to have a common goal to work towards. Hopefully we'll get to play it on mapnight :D
The multiplayer test was a big MESS :D. One bug after another, so I havent even had a proper multipleyer test yet (The most things should be fixed though).
And it seems the difficulty on arena is quite brutal. Not a single first time player have made trough the first challenge on their first try (its to be expected though, but I I thnk I should add more options right from the start or gain those options faster).
Yea the move between ares indication seems to be needed...not many people understand GATE = ANOTHER AREA :/....I wonder if I need beaconds or would Arrows be enough...
You should be able to move back to starting area....I never encountered such a bug that doesnt allow you to go back...
I did try to create immersive atmoshpere though...Like you would learn how to use spells first and get into the world. How would you add that manliness? I first wanted to add crowd and such, but it didnt look quite right...I got 0 ideas on this. I think it aint that bad, allthough I dont like the intro too much either (but its pretty much neccecary evil)
Well Ill continue on with the testing and fixes. Testing with random people should show the flaws better than playing with you :D
I will probly leave this out there till mapnight is over and then take it out again.
and I will most likely add world map if I ever happent to create more areas...Im not sure how complete I would make the map. Probly indicating your location and perhaps even quest locations.
after testing is finished Ill try to analyze whats working and not and move on from that
Yea the move between ares indication seems to be needed...not many people understand GATE = ANOTHER AREA :/....I wonder if I need beaconds or would Arrows be enough...
You should be able to move back to starting area....I never encountered such a bug that doesnt allow you to go back...
You see, some people like to scroll their mouse wheel from time to time for no apparent reason. If we get not regular game camera we can't help but to scroll in and out at least once. Unfortunately, once you touch mouse wheel you can't zoom out. As a result you:
1) Won't see gates at all;
2) Won't be able to return to starting arena simply because you can't click in that place cause you can't see with regular camera that far.
So please, adjust default mouse wheel zooms to the one you give us by default.
I did try to create immersive atmoshpere though...Like you would learn how to use spells first and get into the world. How would you add that manliness? I first wanted to add crowd and such, but it didnt look quite right...I got 0 ideas on this. I think it aint that bad, allthough I dont like the intro too much either (but its pretty much neccecary evil)
I'll talk about intro some other time (maybe xD), but about immersion..
doesn't sound like anything I could comprehend. Sounds like something out of cartoon :D
Also, another point for future, right now this world feels stale. I start as rank 100, so where are others 99 gladiators.. or at least 15 of them? All tables are empty, no random guys wondering around or performing actions (like training, exercising, brawling or simply drinking at a bar (except for disco dave, I bet he feels alone too)). Would be so cool to have a list of all gladiators with their ranks with brief description (and star ratings on different aspects such as endurance or magic control). Maybe have a different team events where you would get paired with random guy close to your position... hold on, I'm talking about a whole different game here >.<
Back to your map! Please hide health bars for invincible units (or at least nydus worms and items).
You make fair points. I was also planning to add "active" cities. I also feel like currently there might not be enough to do...
But I still manage to find various bugs in multiplayer and that my top priority ATM is to fix them.
Also you can meet king ultra at the cave (If you are under rank 92 and havent beaten him, it might show you something interesting)
Mmm but keep the ideas coming. Im not sure whatkind of activity will I add. Minigames would be one idea that comes in mind (you could duel disco dave and others in them). But I suppose I would prefer just hacing the hack and slash style...If I take all different routes It will take even longer to finish this...
It's not that I want to do more. I want to explore more. Explore the world and settings. Right now I got no idea where I am. I look around, see tables, chairs, decorations, am I at my local caffe? Temple walls, some trees, gates, blacksmith and many crates + stuff. The only thing I figured so far is that I'm at some sort of camp which on one side is connected to forest and on other to some sort of wasteland. And for some reason I can fight hordes of monsters in some sort of arena that is inside the camp (or is it some sort of fighters guild?). I it feels weird to fight them inside the camp when there are plenty of them outside. And besides, there aren't that many people in the camp, shouldn't I be better of guarding camp instead?.. Lots of confusion is my first impression :D
I honestly feel more like adventurer than gladiator right now. How do you want me to feel?
Btw, I play with healthbars always on so It really bothers me when invincible units which I can't affect have their health displayed. Makes me think I can a-click them, which I can't.
I noticed some Monster Hunter references and the current game reminds me exactly at this.
Some things I want to point at:
Leveling progress: I noticed some spells received at lvl 28. I played approx. 20 minutes and was only level 3. Especially in Starcraft 2 fun maps I would really dislike such a slow level progression. I don't want to imagine how long it takes to maximum level. And there are 4 mage types.
Upgrading Spells: Upgrading single spells is a must-have feature today. But there are various problems. First of all level 3 for a level 1 spell become obsolete relatively quickly while upgrading high level spells is too strong. Secondly upgrading only stats on a spell is fairly boring. The changes aren't got to be noticed easily or the players ask themselves: "Do it work properly?"
Inventory: The hotkey 1 is a taboo for everything else than team management. I used so many pots without noticing it. In WC3 was the num pad fairly suitable for using items.
Coordination: As I mentioned in the chat: Transitions needs a floatable text-message where it transists. The arrow on the floor isn't very useful, but it fills it purpose. (There is an exit.)
Passives: I played as a poison mage and it very dangerous with such concepts. At level 1 I tryed the spells, nothing to mention. But level 2 was very different. I tryed Locust Swarm and was shocked. Combinated with the two passives I was fairly immortal. Locust Swarm, Passive 1 and walking, walking, walking. Meditation even helps me to "fight" incoming waves in the arena.
Death: Except one respawn death of some ultralisks I never felt any danger in the game. It was some kind of quite the whole time.
As expected the gameplay is not that good yet. I tried to write up some of the problems and how to fix them.
Problem/fixes
No feeling of progressions
Leveling abilities would make spells have better effects (bigger blast radius, more missiles etc.)
Talent tree might or might not be modified. I kind of like my earlier UI...I might just try to think of something new anyway.
Not immersive wold
add villagers to down, make the terrain more belivable instead of monsters outside random place.
Bosses feel too much same
somekind of modified reward. perhaps something to reward you the better you do in the match (less damage taken, more damage dealt in short period of time)
Also the current leveling feels a bit off.
Well Ill leave you with my previous UI...Ill still have to thinkin about this for a while before modifying anything.
Another thing you might consider spell availability at the start.
Usually you start with only one spell which you cast to death for some time. Then there comes that awesome time when you unlock another spell. Now you can cast 100% more spells. You can combine these two spells to invent optimal combat strategy, or keep using them separately if you want so. Then, some time later another spell unlocks and opens a whole new array of possibilities. By that time you have already mastered other two spells so now you can try to combine them with your new, 3rd spell. See how it works and develop different tactics/strategies for your spellset.
The point is, you are given a spell and a time and place to master it. After you mastered it a new gameplay element (spell) unlocks for you to explore. You learn and experiment with what these spells/combos can do, and then proceed on using acquired knowledge to complete given challenges.
I played ice mage and didn’t feel like there was much to his spells.
1st spell is high damage piercing projectile. You just kill 10+ monsters in one shot and there is practically no drawback to that spell. Blizzard never even stood close to total damage dealt compared to that spell. In fact I like blizzard better. It trades your mobility for damage. And you have to time it or monsters will just walk past it and go kill you while you cast it. But I almost never used cause 1st spell is just plain better.
If I was given just blizzard to use, it would be more fun to practice timing and experiment. I would even probably appreciate slow spell since I could use slow to trap monsters and then cast blizzard on them for optimal damage. But why bother when I can just use 1st spell, unlike others, it deals insane amounts of damage and has no drawbacks. (Would probably be better if it was channeled spell instead. Maybe some sort of ice lance which expands from you in a line but requires you to stop for prepare/cast phase?)
But what I described fits killing normal monsters, no idea how practical it would be against those 10+k hp bosses which require you to constantly move, which I feel is another piece of the puzzle. Right now my usual bossfight is dodge/dodge/dodge/throw spell when I got mana and aren’t running away from his spell. It’s just that, dodge-spam spells (and a-move when he’s going after somebody else). Maybe having more timing based spells would force players to be more careful of bosses actions, take notes when he is casting spell and tactically choose location to charge up your own spells? Less HP, less damage amount thrown around, more tactics(yeah, I know it’s hard to do :x).
So it might also be your spell design that’s holding map back.
I promised I'd leave feedback the next time i played it.
First of all, your actor work and bosses are pretty great I think (Mechanics wise), but some things felt a bit odd.
I played the lightning mage this time. First of all, I saw something about combining elements. Poison + Fire and Lightning + Ice if I remember right. I could see the poison AoE DoT get blow up, but when I cast my lightning spells on top of Ducky's ice ones, I have no idea whether that did anything. I somehow prefer the poison mage, it had that swarm thingy that healed me I believe, and could learn a heal spell if I remembered right. With lightning I had pretty much just plain and simple damage, plus a damage AoE that slowed as well, which got kinda boring. Click = Boom.
I can't remember whether you had any sound effects for the spells, but in case you don't add them, and for big spells maybe see if you can make me louder (I'd like to hear some loud thunder when that lightning strikes from the sky. Ofc, it mightve been there and I just cant remember >.>) The spell effects themselves were pretty damn good.
When I think of the elements, this is what comes to mind:
Fire = Explosions, AoE, Burns (DoTs), damage
Poison = DoTs, Debuffs, possibly heals as well
Ice = Slows, Damage reductions, stuns, control
Lightning = High non-AoE damage, bounce, quick, stuns
So, looking at that list, for me lightning was fire. Poison sort of fits, haven't played ice, and I think fire fits its theme as well. But lightning felt like just different looking AoEs. Chain Lightning being the first spell you get might change that, as would some of the diablo spells (Spark and that linear lightning) that appeared in Dungeon Siege 2 (And maybe the other ones as well)
Also, having different auto attacks would be nice. Lightning mage having some sort of archon like attack, fire throwing fireballs, etc. even if its only different visuals, would make things a lot nicer.
The other thing that was bothering was that while I could easily see how much destruction I caused against "trash" mobs, it felt like I did nothing against the bosses. Ofc, when I checked their health I knew we were doing damage, and it didnt feel slow at all, but the health bar didnt reflect that.
Suggestions: Boss health dialog. That would help a lot. Seeing that huge number go down rapidly would make me feel as if I were doing something.
And damage text tags. You don't have *that* many units that it would cause lag, so I dont think they should cause problems. Being able to see the damage you (and even others) do would be pretty nice.
And yea, I didnt notice we could leave that room until someone walked out of it. The terrain could definitely be improved there (Arena is fine I think, I dont think its supposed to look special. But I'm sure there could be more impressive terrains. Maybe put up civilians on top of the cliffs, as if they were spectators?)
ANd yea, making number 1 the hotkey for the items was a bad move >.> So annoying. Almost everyone uses 1 as their "important" control group (Heroes in hero maps, army in army maps, workers in TDs/Tugs, etc.) I dont know whether this is possible, but you could maybe use the f buttons?
Also, have you considered making a melee/physical class? If you would like ideas, I've got some.
The fire talent tree layout looks alright. If you need a custom background image/button images, I could give it a shot if you like.
There are sounds on the spells, but indeed they might be really silent. Cause I usually play music I havent really observed how loud the sounds are (+ my custom sounds settings).
I was planning to add melee class and summoner class, but as the exciting classes still need work Ill only forcus for the 4 for now.
Fire and Ice are indeed quite similar, maybe even too similar. And when I tested out the arcane spells in actual battle they felt quite nice. Arcane spells are more of supportive spells (shields, heals, slow) and probly other classes could use similar spells too.
And regarding the ICE + LIGHTNING. It works similar to FIRE + POISON. Lightning just amplifies the ice damage (It can be only used on ice blocks you see on the ground, like blizzard leave those ice blocks)
Also queen boss had some bugs, some spells didnt deal any damage...Ill have to look into that.
I dont know about you, but I think the bosses should be nearly stationary. I like that you dont have to run around all the time, but just to dodge the spells.(maybe not 0 movement speed, but perhaps a bit slower).
Well thanks for feeback. Its always nice to hear something and try to improve on it.
After testing today once more. I feel like gameplay needs a bit more improvement. Its already decent, but not really a stellar experience (not saying that it will ever be that)...
I dont know about you, but I think the bosses should be nearly stationary. I like that you dont have to run around all the time, but just to dodge the spells.(maybe not 0 movement speed, but perhaps a bit slower).
I'd suggest you to keep a good balance between stationary bosses and constant moving bosses. Movement can be just as creative and unique as spells, but most people tend to overlook it.
My side project is soon to be finished so might return to this one again.
Iv been thinking of wheter Ill continue on the project at its current form. Currently its heading to become a mediocre RPG, and I do not want to make a mediocre RPG.
But anyway I do want to use the things I created in one way or another. Making an RPG is not out of the picture yet, but I cannot think of anything that would really help me to make the experience I want to deliver.
I feel like the customization system might not be a best for RPG. Currently you only have 4 active spells while most RPGs you can select one from 100 others....
Well as I said Im not totally sure what Ill do with it. I just dont have ideas to improve on this.
Iv been working on making new battle system from wilderness, since it felt very wrong...Now it might be actually fun, we shall see once I get the next version done.
New intro. As some suggested it felt a bit off...Im not sure if the new intro makes any more sense, but Im trying to build more beliviable world.
Still very many things to do thou. Hero skills need levels and I need to implement passive skills someway that it would feel right...
This truly feels like a project that will never be finished, but might as well try to do something every now and then.
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Even after the dramatic discussion I decided to continue the project. It does not really matter if I get everything I want in to the game. Ill just do my best to deliver a good gaming experience.
Progress:
It will still be a while before next test. I might also expand 4 active skills to 5 and perhaps even increase player limit. 6-8 would be a good number, but increasing player limit might cause some problems too...
Basic RPG systems:
As one could expect making RPG takes so much time. Just making the basic systems takes time and I just get feeling of it not going anywhere -_-.
And there is much to think about. How to handle the leveling and questing...
Currently Im leaning towards one main quest and you can have multiple personal quests. And the main quest can be done by leveling up or following the story...(so you can kind of decide what style you want to play, even though its still actiong RPG).
Leveling will most likely affect your health,mana and spellpower. You can currently have 1 element you want to learn but I could do something like you could pick elements when you level up (more same type elements give you better spells on the elemental trees). But I might just go with level up and equipment affect your spellpower....
Zerg wizard
Hope red "close window" cross will have a hotkey, otherwise it has to be 100 times larger, because it's a torture to press 10 times a minute a button which is smaller then the cursor.
New versions is out! (If you want to test throw me a PM, its again open secret beta).
Published on EU
Test version includes
Generally this could be a style I would go with the map. I might change few stuff, but lets first see what people think of it....
I have not tested it in multiplayer at all. So I would appriciate if someone would try to test with couple of people, allthough it supports 1-4 players.
After this I might take a break though. Fixing and making the basic stuff was kinda consuming...but I tend to get obsessed on something like getting a decent test version out.
Alright, finally got to play :D
If you count this as preview to where things are going I can say we're gonna have ourselves a sweet map in the future.
Things that bothered me:
-unexpectedly high damage. I think I start with 450 health thinking that I'm pretty durable and then see my health drop rapidly as I take any damage. And then I go to jungle and see that zerglings do 10 dmg with cooldown of 0.1 sec.. yay for 100 dps zerglings
:D(But I like it. Makes me want to get that armor + I like punishing monsters.. It's just that it's rather unexpected and makes me go wtf when I loose 300 hp just cause I that cute looking small zergling get close to me);-would be cool to know how much dmg hydra spit does since it's basically hydras only weapon;
-I can't seem to go back to starting area (where Mercury is) once I move out of it (warp screen doesn't work?);
-Would like it to be more obvious where I can warp between screens. It's not intuitive at all for Starcraft Map (At least for general warps. You can keep secret areas not indicated(what am I talking, that is the point of secret areas.. and you're gonna have them, right?);
-Next wave in arena seem to delay/not start when there are many powerups left from previous round;
-Queen boss burrowcharged into bottom-left gate and I never saw her again.. had to end my game there since there was no way out.
And now for some useless nitpicking since I can :P
-sudden spawns in wilds with no indication that they're coming to warn player;
-Healthbars for invincible units confuse me;
-sad that can only purchase 250 health potion;
-dialogs :D
Also about story.. I'm not sure but I think mixing starcraft names and magick/rpg ruins it for me. Pretty much zero immersion. Also the intro text makes me think I'm playing children tea-party simulator. It's a gladiator realm where men fight to death for gold and glory. Why am I greeted with such friendly and happy atmosphere? This map needs more manliness >.>
And I rally enjoyed playing it in singleplayer, not sure if the same would apply to multiplayer. In SP I can just go chill while killing zerglings in the wilds. In multiplayer I feel players need to have a common goal to work towards. Hopefully we'll get to play it on mapnight :D
Thanks man! I always appriciate the feedback.
The multiplayer test was a big MESS :D. One bug after another, so I havent even had a proper multipleyer test yet (The most things should be fixed though).
And it seems the difficulty on arena is quite brutal. Not a single first time player have made trough the first challenge on their first try (its to be expected though, but I I thnk I should add more options right from the start or gain those options faster).
Yea the move between ares indication seems to be needed...not many people understand GATE = ANOTHER AREA :/....I wonder if I need beaconds or would Arrows be enough...
You should be able to move back to starting area....I never encountered such a bug that doesnt allow you to go back...
I did try to create immersive atmoshpere though...Like you would learn how to use spells first and get into the world. How would you add that manliness? I first wanted to add crowd and such, but it didnt look quite right...I got 0 ideas on this. I think it aint that bad, allthough I dont like the intro too much either (but its pretty much neccecary evil)
Well Ill continue on with the testing and fixes. Testing with random people should show the flaws better than playing with you :D
I will probly leave this out there till mapnight is over and then take it out again.
You see, some people like to scroll their mouse wheel from time to time for no apparent reason. If we get not regular game camera we can't help but to scroll in and out at least once. Unfortunately, once you touch mouse wheel you can't zoom out. As a result you:
1) Won't see gates at all;
2) Won't be able to return to starting arena simply because you can't click in that place cause you can't see with regular camera that far.
So please, adjust default mouse wheel zooms to the one you give us by default.
I'll talk about intro some other time (maybe xD), but about immersion..
doesn't sound like anything I could comprehend. Sounds like something out of cartoon :D
Also, another point for future, right now this world feels stale. I start as rank 100, so where are others 99 gladiators.. or at least 15 of them? All tables are empty, no random guys wondering around or performing actions (like training, exercising, brawling or simply drinking at a bar (except for disco dave, I bet he feels alone too)). Would be so cool to have a list of all gladiators with their ranks with brief description (and star ratings on different aspects such as endurance or magic control). Maybe have a different team events where you would get paired with random guy close to your position... hold on, I'm talking about a whole different game here >.<
Back to your map! Please hide health bars for invincible units (or at least nydus worms and items).
You make fair points. I was also planning to add "active" cities. I also feel like currently there might not be enough to do...
But I still manage to find various bugs in multiplayer and that my top priority ATM is to fix them.
Also you can meet king ultra at the cave (If you are under rank 92 and havent beaten him, it might show you something interesting)
Mmm but keep the ideas coming. Im not sure whatkind of activity will I add. Minigames would be one idea that comes in mind (you could duel disco dave and others in them). But I suppose I would prefer just hacing the hack and slash style...If I take all different routes It will take even longer to finish this...
@zenx1: Go
It's not that I want to do more. I want to explore more. Explore the world and settings. Right now I got no idea where I am. I look around, see tables, chairs, decorations, am I at my local caffe? Temple walls, some trees, gates, blacksmith and many crates + stuff. The only thing I figured so far is that I'm at some sort of camp which on one side is connected to forest and on other to some sort of wasteland. And for some reason I can fight hordes of monsters in some sort of arena that is inside the camp (or is it some sort of fighters guild?). I it feels weird to fight them inside the camp when there are plenty of them outside. And besides, there aren't that many people in the camp, shouldn't I be better of guarding camp instead?.. Lots of confusion is my first impression :D
I honestly feel more like adventurer than gladiator right now. How do you want me to feel?
Btw, I play with healthbars always on so It really bothers me when invincible units which I can't affect have their health displayed. Makes me think I can a-click them, which I can't.
For those who want to test it...its still avaialable today under the name "secret test map" on EU.
Last day to test again. Most of the reported and noticed bugs have been fixed. After this Im back to development...
I noticed some Monster Hunter references and the current game reminds me exactly at this.
Some things I want to point at:
Leveling progress: I noticed some spells received at lvl 28. I played approx. 20 minutes and was only level 3. Especially in Starcraft 2 fun maps I would really dislike such a slow level progression. I don't want to imagine how long it takes to maximum level. And there are 4 mage types.
Upgrading Spells: Upgrading single spells is a must-have feature today. But there are various problems. First of all level 3 for a level 1 spell become obsolete relatively quickly while upgrading high level spells is too strong. Secondly upgrading only stats on a spell is fairly boring. The changes aren't got to be noticed easily or the players ask themselves: "Do it work properly?"
Inventory: The hotkey 1 is a taboo for everything else than team management. I used so many pots without noticing it. In WC3 was the num pad fairly suitable for using items.
Coordination: As I mentioned in the chat: Transitions needs a floatable text-message where it transists. The arrow on the floor isn't very useful, but it fills it purpose. (There is an exit.)
Passives: I played as a poison mage and it very dangerous with such concepts. At level 1 I tryed the spells, nothing to mention. But level 2 was very different. I tryed Locust Swarm and was shocked. Combinated with the two passives I was fairly immortal. Locust Swarm, Passive 1 and walking, walking, walking. Meditation even helps me to "fight" incoming waves in the arena.
Death: Except one respawn death of some ultralisks I never felt any danger in the game. It was some kind of quite the whole time.
As expected the gameplay is not that good yet. I tried to write up some of the problems and how to fix them.
Problem/fixes
No feeling of progressions
Not immersive wold
Bosses feel too much same
Also the current leveling feels a bit off.
Well Ill leave you with my previous UI...Ill still have to thinkin about this for a while before modifying anything.
Another thing you might consider spell availability at the start.
Usually you start with only one spell which you cast to death for some time. Then there comes that awesome time when you unlock another spell. Now you can cast 100% more spells. You can combine these two spells to invent optimal combat strategy, or keep using them separately if you want so. Then, some time later another spell unlocks and opens a whole new array of possibilities. By that time you have already mastered other two spells so now you can try to combine them with your new, 3rd spell. See how it works and develop different tactics/strategies for your spellset. The point is, you are given a spell and a time and place to master it. After you mastered it a new gameplay element (spell) unlocks for you to explore. You learn and experiment with what these spells/combos can do, and then proceed on using acquired knowledge to complete given challenges.
I played ice mage and didn’t feel like there was much to his spells.
1st spell is high damage piercing projectile. You just kill 10+ monsters in one shot and there is practically no drawback to that spell. Blizzard never even stood close to total damage dealt compared to that spell. In fact I like blizzard better. It trades your mobility for damage. And you have to time it or monsters will just walk past it and go kill you while you cast it. But I almost never used cause 1st spell is just plain better.
If I was given just blizzard to use, it would be more fun to practice timing and experiment. I would even probably appreciate slow spell since I could use slow to trap monsters and then cast blizzard on them for optimal damage. But why bother when I can just use 1st spell, unlike others, it deals insane amounts of damage and has no drawbacks. (Would probably be better if it was channeled spell instead. Maybe some sort of ice lance which expands from you in a line but requires you to stop for prepare/cast phase?)
But what I described fits killing normal monsters, no idea how practical it would be against those 10+k hp bosses which require you to constantly move, which I feel is another piece of the puzzle. Right now my usual bossfight is dodge/dodge/dodge/throw spell when I got mana and aren’t running away from his spell. It’s just that, dodge-spam spells (and a-move when he’s going after somebody else). Maybe having more timing based spells would force players to be more careful of bosses actions, take notes when he is casting spell and tactically choose location to charge up your own spells? Less HP, less damage amount thrown around, more tactics(yeah, I know it’s hard to do :x).
So it might also be your spell design that’s holding map back.
I promised I'd leave feedback the next time i played it.
First of all, your actor work and bosses are pretty great I think (Mechanics wise), but some things felt a bit odd.
I played the lightning mage this time. First of all, I saw something about combining elements. Poison + Fire and Lightning + Ice if I remember right. I could see the poison AoE DoT get blow up, but when I cast my lightning spells on top of Ducky's ice ones, I have no idea whether that did anything. I somehow prefer the poison mage, it had that swarm thingy that healed me I believe, and could learn a heal spell if I remembered right. With lightning I had pretty much just plain and simple damage, plus a damage AoE that slowed as well, which got kinda boring. Click = Boom.
I can't remember whether you had any sound effects for the spells, but in case you don't add them, and for big spells maybe see if you can make me louder (I'd like to hear some loud thunder when that lightning strikes from the sky. Ofc, it mightve been there and I just cant remember >.>) The spell effects themselves were pretty damn good.
When I think of the elements, this is what comes to mind:
So, looking at that list, for me lightning was fire. Poison sort of fits, haven't played ice, and I think fire fits its theme as well. But lightning felt like just different looking AoEs. Chain Lightning being the first spell you get might change that, as would some of the diablo spells (Spark and that linear lightning) that appeared in Dungeon Siege 2 (And maybe the other ones as well) Also, having different auto attacks would be nice. Lightning mage having some sort of archon like attack, fire throwing fireballs, etc. even if its only different visuals, would make things a lot nicer.
The other thing that was bothering was that while I could easily see how much destruction I caused against "trash" mobs, it felt like I did nothing against the bosses. Ofc, when I checked their health I knew we were doing damage, and it didnt feel slow at all, but the health bar didnt reflect that. Suggestions: Boss health dialog. That would help a lot. Seeing that huge number go down rapidly would make me feel as if I were doing something. And damage text tags. You don't have *that* many units that it would cause lag, so I dont think they should cause problems. Being able to see the damage you (and even others) do would be pretty nice.
And yea, I didnt notice we could leave that room until someone walked out of it. The terrain could definitely be improved there (Arena is fine I think, I dont think its supposed to look special. But I'm sure there could be more impressive terrains. Maybe put up civilians on top of the cliffs, as if they were spectators?)
ANd yea, making number 1 the hotkey for the items was a bad move >.> So annoying. Almost everyone uses 1 as their "important" control group (Heroes in hero maps, army in army maps, workers in TDs/Tugs, etc.) I dont know whether this is possible, but you could maybe use the f buttons?
Also, have you considered making a melee/physical class? If you would like ideas, I've got some. The fire talent tree layout looks alright. If you need a custom background image/button images, I could give it a shot if you like.
There are sounds on the spells, but indeed they might be really silent. Cause I usually play music I havent really observed how loud the sounds are (+ my custom sounds settings).
I was planning to add melee class and summoner class, but as the exciting classes still need work Ill only forcus for the 4 for now.
Fire and Ice are indeed quite similar, maybe even too similar. And when I tested out the arcane spells in actual battle they felt quite nice. Arcane spells are more of supportive spells (shields, heals, slow) and probly other classes could use similar spells too.
And regarding the ICE + LIGHTNING. It works similar to FIRE + POISON. Lightning just amplifies the ice damage (It can be only used on ice blocks you see on the ground, like blizzard leave those ice blocks)
Also queen boss had some bugs, some spells didnt deal any damage...Ill have to look into that.
I dont know about you, but I think the bosses should be nearly stationary. I like that you dont have to run around all the time, but just to dodge the spells.(maybe not 0 movement speed, but perhaps a bit slower).
Well thanks for feeback. Its always nice to hear something and try to improve on it.
After testing today once more. I feel like gameplay needs a bit more improvement. Its already decent, but not really a stellar experience (not saying that it will ever be that)...
Zenx sure loves his elements :P.
I'd suggest you to keep a good balance between stationary bosses and constant moving bosses. Movement can be just as creative and unique as spells, but most people tend to overlook it.
My side project is soon to be finished so might return to this one again.
Iv been thinking of wheter Ill continue on the project at its current form. Currently its heading to become a mediocre RPG, and I do not want to make a mediocre RPG.
But anyway I do want to use the things I created in one way or another. Making an RPG is not out of the picture yet, but I cannot think of anything that would really help me to make the experience I want to deliver.
I feel like the customization system might not be a best for RPG. Currently you only have 4 active spells while most RPGs you can select one from 100 others....
Well as I said Im not totally sure what Ill do with it. I just dont have ideas to improve on this.
Im gona go back to my normal work: http://belarr.com/bakercat/
Continued with the project for couple days.
Still very many things to do thou. Hero skills need levels and I need to implement passive skills someway that it would feel right...
This truly feels like a project that will never be finished, but might as well try to do something every now and then.