I'm just in the last stages of creating a mod which can be added to any map and will keep track of the players ELO rating.
For those of you who do not know what an ELO rating is it is the ratings system used in chess and many other competitions (including League of Legends).
This is so that people in clans who practice against eachother in custom games already can have a rating to compare each other with. Simply looking at things like ladder ranking will not be an effective way to compare players. In fact, many people have been requesting that the public ladder be an ELO system from the release of SC2.
How it works is:
join the game with your opponent.
you can create a new tournament and provide a password if you wish it to be private
select which tournaments you would like to be rated in.
click on "ready" and the game will begin.
each players score will be recorded based on win/loss and updated for the next game.
I have included some pics to demonstrate the creation/selection of tournaments
at the start of the game:
One player inviting the other to a tournament
Players click on "compete" to enter the tournament
Demonstration of me trying to cheat by editing my bank file and providing a false password for a private tournament
I am currently looking for people to help test the mod or to just provide general feedback. at the moment there is only 1 map released with this mod which is "ELO Cloud Kingdom". Just search for ELO on NA server and it should be listed. Thanks and I look forward to hearing what you all think.
Bye.
EDIT: I forgot to mention that this was created on my monitor with a resolution of 1280x720. For people using a SMALLER resolution this may not work as there is no way to detect screen resolution in game and adjust for it.
What SC2 uses it's called MMR... so it has such thing. It's just not seen publicly. Actually I find what you do interesting, in my system that is still MMR, I could do that too comparing that value to match each others so I get your point. But I didn't do because mine was just a library, not a whole map to compare players.
Now there are two things - basing how much points you gain or lose (ladder points but MMR too) based on the opponent you match
Since the latest patch you can match some different leagues, so if you want to make it up-to-date, might have to make it so that you match more than just closest to you. E.g Gold is 400 Plat is 600 Diam is 800, you wanna match with anyone ranging from gold's to diamond's rating.
MMR is simillar to an ELO ranking from what I understand of it. But like you said you cannot know what it is and it is not a very useful way for players to compare against eachother especially at high levels.
This was actually a request by one of the top clans on SEA server. So if they want to rank their players then their ladder rank is not a useful way to compare the best players in the region against eachother.
ELO scores also come with a mathamatical prediction on the outcome. For example if you look at the 3rd pic of HerO vs Sheth in the active tournament list there are the numbers
Global 53%-47%
TL Forums 55%-45%
which are the calculations of the percentage chance each player has to win.
Sorry, I found your post a little hard to understand. Did you create a library that did something simillar? what does it do?
In ladder MMR is the thing that represents players' performance so it is the one that matters especially on Master where the system chooses to match based on this match making rating and also based on it, promotes or demotes to leagues. The MMR is not visible however, otherwise it is the one determining - not WinRate % or League when all are Masters on Master level. I am saying that in a system I did, I use MMR as a value to promote or demote to a league but since it's a library, not a playable map, I did not compare players by MMR as the map has no players to match each other, it's not a game, just a library. So I see how you compare players.
As for predicting who would win, that reminds me of the 'Favored'/Slightly Favored' system that is used and determining it based on that.
OK there is some kind of communication problem going on here because I don't understand what you are saying and I don't think you understand what I am saying either.
You keep trying to explaining to me how the ladder works on Battlenet. I completely 100% understand how the ladder works.
A lot of really good players spend a lot of time training and versing against other clan members and other really good players. They do this in custom games not ladder. Ladder rank and MMR are completely seperate.
There are many people (Masters and Grandmasters) who find that the ladder is a verry BAD way of comparing two players and they want a BETTER way to compare players. It is their belief and mine that this is a far BETTER way for a close knit group of players such as a clan to compare against each other.
Can you send me a link to information about this library you keep mentioning. I do not understand the way you are trying to explain it.
OK, I found the library where you have made a system which records win/loss/win percentage and assigns people into your own custom leagues.
You didn't say that this was your own custom ranking system and leagues. You were making it sound like you were integrating it with the official battlenet MMR and leagues system and using those to match players against eachother which is not what it does.
The mod that I made is also a library not just a single map. It can be imported into any map you chose. It is currently released on only one map but when I am finished it will be released on several maps.
Out of curiosity what formula did you use for your custom ranking system?
No, I understood you. My system is following simply the ladder (with all its pros and cons i.e it is just a prototype), while you want to make something more accurate for deciding skill. I mention the MMR because you never mentioned it and I thought you don't know what it means and what it is, all can be seen in the ExcaliburZ's bnet thread where he explains it.
Quote:
Out of curiosity what formula did you use for your custom ranking system?
Like I said, my system is only to record the WLRatio and to make a League Promotion/Demotion based on a hidden value (just a variable) called MMR and based on what value it reaches a player gets promoted to the next league or demoted, not actually ranking any players since, yours seems to be the one ranking players.
A certain amount of MMR has to be reached to get promoted or demoted in a league, the more games you make, the more MMR you need. Meaning the 'uncertainty factor' is lesser and more certain where you are with more games you need to prove by doing a lot more wins to get promoted.
So actually our systems are about two different things, mine records the stats and promotes/demotes league, yours uses ELO system to rank players., so erm will be useful to have your system too. If someone uses my system for stats plus your ELO system will get the perfect combo :) PEEP mode should use that
I'm just in the last stages of creating a mod which can be added to any map and will keep track of the players ELO rating.
For those of you who do not know what an ELO rating is it is the ratings system used in chess and many other competitions (including League of Legends).
This is so that people in clans who practice against eachother in custom games already can have a rating to compare each other with. Simply looking at things like ladder ranking will not be an effective way to compare players. In fact, many people have been requesting that the public ladder be an ELO system from the release of SC2.
How it works is:
I have included some pics to demonstrate the creation/selection of tournaments
at the start of the game:
One player inviting the other to a tournament
Players click on "compete" to enter the tournament
Demonstration of me trying to cheat by editing my bank file and providing a false password for a private tournament
I am currently looking for people to help test the mod or to just provide general feedback. at the moment there is only 1 map released with this mod which is "ELO Cloud Kingdom". Just search for ELO on NA server and it should be listed. Thanks and I look forward to hearing what you all think.
Bye.
EDIT: I forgot to mention that this was created on my monitor with a resolution of 1280x720. For people using a SMALLER resolution this may not work as there is no way to detect screen resolution in game and adjust for it.
What SC2 uses it's called MMR... so it has such thing. It's just not seen publicly. Actually I find what you do interesting, in my system that is still MMR, I could do that too comparing that value to match each others so I get your point. But I didn't do because mine was just a library, not a whole map to compare players.
Now there are two things - basing how much points you gain or lose (ladder points but MMR too) based on the opponent you match
Since the latest patch you can match some different leagues, so if you want to make it up-to-date, might have to make it so that you match more than just closest to you. E.g Gold is 400 Plat is 600 Diam is 800, you wanna match with anyone ranging from gold's to diamond's rating.
@Eimtr: Go
MMR is simillar to an ELO ranking from what I understand of it. But like you said you cannot know what it is and it is not a very useful way for players to compare against eachother especially at high levels.
This was actually a request by one of the top clans on SEA server. So if they want to rank their players then their ladder rank is not a useful way to compare the best players in the region against eachother.
ELO scores also come with a mathamatical prediction on the outcome. For example if you look at the 3rd pic of HerO vs Sheth in the active tournament list there are the numbers
Global 53%-47% TL Forums 55%-45%
which are the calculations of the percentage chance each player has to win.
Sorry, I found your post a little hard to understand. Did you create a library that did something simillar? what does it do?
@finiteturtles: Go
In ladder MMR is the thing that represents players' performance so it is the one that matters especially on Master where the system chooses to match based on this match making rating and also based on it, promotes or demotes to leagues. The MMR is not visible however, otherwise it is the one determining - not WinRate % or League when all are Masters on Master level. I am saying that in a system I did, I use MMR as a value to promote or demote to a league but since it's a library, not a playable map, I did not compare players by MMR as the map has no players to match each other, it's not a game, just a library. So I see how you compare players.
As for predicting who would win, that reminds me of the 'Favored'/Slightly Favored' system that is used and determining it based on that.
@Eimtr: Go
OK there is some kind of communication problem going on here because I don't understand what you are saying and I don't think you understand what I am saying either.
You keep trying to explaining to me how the ladder works on Battlenet. I completely 100% understand how the ladder works.
A lot of really good players spend a lot of time training and versing against other clan members and other really good players. They do this in custom games not ladder. Ladder rank and MMR are completely seperate.
There are many people (Masters and Grandmasters) who find that the ladder is a verry BAD way of comparing two players and they want a BETTER way to compare players. It is their belief and mine that this is a far BETTER way for a close knit group of players such as a clan to compare against each other.
Can you send me a link to information about this library you keep mentioning. I do not understand the way you are trying to explain it.
@Eimtr: Go
OK, I found the library where you have made a system which records win/loss/win percentage and assigns people into your own custom leagues.
You didn't say that this was your own custom ranking system and leagues. You were making it sound like you were integrating it with the official battlenet MMR and leagues system and using those to match players against eachother which is not what it does.
The mod that I made is also a library not just a single map. It can be imported into any map you chose. It is currently released on only one map but when I am finished it will be released on several maps.
Out of curiosity what formula did you use for your custom ranking system?
How do you handle global? I wasn't aware that you could do anything beyond local bank file.
@Karawasa: Go
Each tournament is all in one local bank file. "Global" is just the name of one tournament. It is created automatically and cannot be deleted.
@finiteturtles: Go
No, I understood you. My system is following simply the ladder (with all its pros and cons i.e it is just a prototype), while you want to make something more accurate for deciding skill. I mention the MMR because you never mentioned it and I thought you don't know what it means and what it is, all can be seen in the ExcaliburZ's bnet thread where he explains it.
Like I said, my system is only to record the WLRatio and to make a League Promotion/Demotion based on a hidden value (just a variable) called MMR and based on what value it reaches a player gets promoted to the next league or demoted, not actually ranking any players since, yours seems to be the one ranking players.
A certain amount of MMR has to be reached to get promoted or demoted in a league, the more games you make, the more MMR you need. Meaning the 'uncertainty factor' is lesser and more certain where you are with more games you need to prove by doing a lot more wins to get promoted.
So actually our systems are about two different things, mine records the stats and promotes/demotes league, yours uses ELO system to rank players., so erm will be useful to have your system too. If someone uses my system for stats plus your ELO system will get the perfect combo :) PEEP mode should use that
When this will be relesed?