You know those kind of maps where you spawn units to attack the enemy's base? By building buildings or whatnot? They're a nice genre but they're becoming too common already. I like playing those games once in a while back in Warcraft 3, but now it's almost half the popular maps in Blizzard.
Then there's this genre too rare. I couldn't find any games like these. Simulation games like Life of a Peasant or Natural Selection (A game where you make an animal and select its traits and see if it can survive in the wild.), mini-games like Pass the Bomb and Who is the killer, strategies like World War Z and even World War 2 or simple fun games like Dawn of the Dead. (All these are WC3 maps)
I haven't seen a game like that in SC2. If you can tell me a name of a map that fits one of those, tell me. Tho, they probably don't get that much joiners because of the incredibly stupid Popularity sorting which forcibly killed variety flavoring of the old Battle.Net...
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Member since 2010. Made the -The Thing- [Revival] game. Nostalgic of the WC3 days.
Most of the maps you mentioned already exist you just have to search down the popularity tree to find them. Loap like = Harvest moon (I think haven't actually tried it), Whos the killer = Malum Ruina WW2 = Various Diplo maps.
I myself am making a complex Whos the killer map and have been working on it and experimenting with the editor since beta. Unless you have a huge amount of free time it takes allot of time to make a complete complex map and even then chances are it will simply be lost on page 72 of popularity. Remember map makers make there maps for free for your benefit and they don't have arbitrary timelines. Give the map makers a little time and give Blizzard a little time to fix/remove popularity + add some much desired features to the editor.
Ive had lots of tests/assignments/exams ever since starcraft 2 came out.... damn uni ;(.
Because of which, ive started making a few maps, but not had any free time to finish any of them
once uni has finished (christmas holidays), im sure alot more people will have more free time, so more good maps will be released
i myself would like to See a Life of a Peasent (never played it myself, but a friend told me it was good, and The life of a civilian was my favorate gametype to play on SC1) If anyone sees anything like the Sims like gametype, let me know,
I've seen The Life of a Terran already, it looked great in the details for it, but all the links and red says its dead. I Definetly need to earn scripting and such. this is one of the games that SC2 needs.
what are these life of a ... maps?
the few words about natural selection sound like something i'd like to do. have some nice ideas already but i doubt they are new
There might actually be maps, like the ones you have described already on battle.net but they may be buried underneath all of the popular maps.
The problem I see as to why people may not have created these maps is that the people who wanted them made may have attempted to make them. Sometimes the editor is a little daunting and people may lose interest in their map if there is little interest shown for it. Time is also an issue but I feel that the general reason for why people never finish these projects is incentive. People may move onto other projects or ideas that have sparked their interest.
Folks need to get of their pretentionist high horses and accept failure. Stop being so damn artsy and going "ooh yeah, but all those footman arena maps are for the plebs, nobody looks at my sophisticated 'GOOD' map!". In some cases it's downright snobby. Just because Nexus Wars' concept is simpler than your 'intelligent' RPG doesn't make the map worse. In the end all that matters for a map to be 'good' is playability. 'Perfect' maps require playability with polish - the fact that Nexus Wars misses the polish doesn't per definition make it a 'bad map' compared to 'sophisticated RPG X'. You can come up with a playstyle as unique as possible, but if it has no replayability or simply is boring as f*ck then no amount of screaming about how 'good' your map truly is can make up for the fact that Nexus Wars, for all the polish it lacks, is a more amusing and with that better map.
That's not to say the top maps out there are awesome (I hate SOTIS, for example) - there's just a lot of "my map is so misunderstood!" going on that I wanted to bring to attention.
Amen. But Mozared, try telling that to Rodrigo... ah, Debates....
Also, I published a simple defense map (Defend the Pylon) and it rocketed to the top. It's already on the 3rd page and I never expected it to get popular.
I almost want to say tower defenses. There's a lot of potential in this engine for some really unique groundbreaking gameplay that no one's really tapped.
I actually really enjoyed poker defense. I think if that game were a bit more polished and refined it could be a great map, add a betting system. At the start of each round you gotta choose which units to bet adding a ton of stratagy and each could have a numeric value. If players are able to choose what sort of wave to send it adds even more stratagey to betting and balancing killing of enemy waves. Big pots could give super awesome units to the winner and possibly multiplied by the strength of the winning hand.
You could even sprinkle in some rodrigo and have a topic of conversatoin for the random players to discuss each hand or something like that.
At the end of the game players vote for the best socializer so you can have 2 winners, i think that'd pair well with anonymous poker sessions.
Amen. But Mozared, try telling that to Rodrigo... ah, Debates....
Rodrigo gets away with it because he's blatantly obvious and usually makes fun of himself about it in a subtle way. That, and for as far as I don't like Debates, I think the git knows that Nexus Word Wars at least has an interesting concept. Buzz around him as may be, I can at least respect that.
I always liked the concept of a Life as a Peasant, but I never thought it was pulled off quite right in Wc3. More often than not it just turned into an RTS.
Well, seeing as this post was necroed I'll weigh in too. I'm bothered by both sides of this argument. Yes, on the one hand I don't prefer tug/frenzy maps and acknowledge they take less time to make (but do take long to polish). But on the other hand (having had a few popular maps) what may seem simple or trivial in a map may have taken LOTS of balance/polish to be what you see now.
As a player (from the golden age of war3) I am not entirely happy with the choice and selection... Why are people playing the same maps since beta? War3 had a much higher map turnover rate (good and bad) aside from dota. I guess popularity is a fault here; hopefully 1.3 will prove this....
Haha I always check now... necroing is actually really common on sc2mapster i find.
And yeah, it really is an interesting topic... we're all affected by it. We've seen lots of these posts since the beta about players (not just high n mighty mappers) frustrated... Well, there's hundreds of us @sc2mapster with a few people having popular maps, dozen or so random mappers not associated with sc2mapster who have popular maps, and then finally there's the hundred thousand or w/e maps blizzard said are published that aren't popular.
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Curse PremiumYou know those kind of maps where you spawn units to attack the enemy's base? By building buildings or whatnot? They're a nice genre but they're becoming too common already. I like playing those games once in a while back in Warcraft 3, but now it's almost half the popular maps in Blizzard.
Then there's this genre too rare. I couldn't find any games like these. Simulation games like Life of a Peasant or Natural Selection (A game where you make an animal and select its traits and see if it can survive in the wild.), mini-games like Pass the Bomb and Who is the killer, strategies like World War Z and even World War 2 or simple fun games like Dawn of the Dead. (All these are WC3 maps)
I haven't seen a game like that in SC2. If you can tell me a name of a map that fits one of those, tell me. Tho, they probably don't get that much joiners because of the incredibly stupid Popularity sorting which forcibly killed variety flavoring of the old Battle.Net...
Member since 2010. Made the -The Thing- [Revival] game. Nostalgic of the WC3 days.
The reason the common genre is so common is because it takes very little time to create.
The actually good genres take quite a bit of time to create.
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Curse Premium@Sephiex: Go
Not entirely true. And plus, it's been months since the release.
I don't see how time is a factor here anymore.
Member since 2010. Made the -The Thing- [Revival] game. Nostalgic of the WC3 days.
@Vicboy: Go
Takes a lot of time -> People are lazy -> Don't want to spend time -> Don't make complex maps -> No complex maps created
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Curse Premium@dddarrenccc: Go
How exactly will it take too much time? Why are you guys using time as an excuse for the lack of any other genres?
Not all the maps I mentioned will take so much time...
Member since 2010. Made the -The Thing- [Revival] game. Nostalgic of the WC3 days.
If it won't take too much time, then you'll be able to mkae them yourself. :D
Most of the maps you mentioned already exist you just have to search down the popularity tree to find them. Loap like = Harvest moon (I think haven't actually tried it), Whos the killer = Malum Ruina WW2 = Various Diplo maps.
I myself am making a complex Whos the killer map and have been working on it and experimenting with the editor since beta. Unless you have a huge amount of free time it takes allot of time to make a complete complex map and even then chances are it will simply be lost on page 72 of popularity. Remember map makers make there maps for free for your benefit and they don't have arbitrary timelines. Give the map makers a little time and give Blizzard a little time to fix/remove popularity + add some much desired features to the editor.
People tend to want their maps to be played by others, so often they focus on the popular gametypes of the time, to increase those odds.
You have to market a unique map for it to stand out. Even though the map is free. Sad, but true.
Ive had lots of tests/assignments/exams ever since starcraft 2 came out.... damn uni ;(. Because of which, ive started making a few maps, but not had any free time to finish any of them
once uni has finished (christmas holidays), im sure alot more people will have more free time, so more good maps will be released
just wait and see =)
i myself would like to See a Life of a Peasent (never played it myself, but a friend told me it was good, and The life of a civilian was my favorate gametype to play on SC1) If anyone sees anything like the Sims like gametype, let me know, I've seen The Life of a Terran already, it looked great in the details for it, but all the links and red says its dead. I Definetly need to earn scripting and such. this is one of the games that SC2 needs.
what are these life of a ... maps?
the few words about natural selection sound like something i'd like to do. have some nice ideas already but i doubt they are new
There might actually be maps, like the ones you have described already on battle.net but they may be buried underneath all of the popular maps.
The problem I see as to why people may not have created these maps is that the people who wanted them made may have attempted to make them. Sometimes the editor is a little daunting and people may lose interest in their map if there is little interest shown for it. Time is also an issue but I feel that the general reason for why people never finish these projects is incentive. People may move onto other projects or ideas that have sparked their interest.
Also, super massive necro? 141 day gap?
Folks need to get of their pretentionist high horses and accept failure. Stop being so damn artsy and going "ooh yeah, but all those footman arena maps are for the plebs, nobody looks at my sophisticated 'GOOD' map!". In some cases it's downright snobby. Just because Nexus Wars' concept is simpler than your 'intelligent' RPG doesn't make the map worse. In the end all that matters for a map to be 'good' is playability. 'Perfect' maps require playability with polish - the fact that Nexus Wars misses the polish doesn't per definition make it a 'bad map' compared to 'sophisticated RPG X'. You can come up with a playstyle as unique as possible, but if it has no replayability or simply is boring as f*ck then no amount of screaming about how 'good' your map truly is can make up for the fact that Nexus Wars, for all the polish it lacks, is a more amusing and with that better map.
That's not to say the top maps out there are awesome (I hate SOTIS, for example) - there's just a lot of "my map is so misunderstood!" going on that I wanted to bring to attention.
Amen. But Mozared, try telling that to Rodrigo... ah, Debates....
Also, I published a simple defense map (Defend the Pylon) and it rocketed to the top. It's already on the 3rd page and I never expected it to get popular.
I almost want to say tower defenses. There's a lot of potential in this engine for some really unique groundbreaking gameplay that no one's really tapped.
I actually really enjoyed poker defense. I think if that game were a bit more polished and refined it could be a great map, add a betting system. At the start of each round you gotta choose which units to bet adding a ton of stratagy and each could have a numeric value. If players are able to choose what sort of wave to send it adds even more stratagey to betting and balancing killing of enemy waves. Big pots could give super awesome units to the winner and possibly multiplied by the strength of the winning hand.
You could even sprinkle in some rodrigo and have a topic of conversatoin for the random players to discuss each hand or something like that.
At the end of the game players vote for the best socializer so you can have 2 winners, i think that'd pair well with anonymous poker sessions.
Rodrigo gets away with it because he's blatantly obvious and usually makes fun of himself about it in a subtle way. That, and for as far as I don't like Debates, I think the git knows that Nexus Word Wars at least has an interesting concept. Buzz around him as may be, I can at least respect that.
I always liked the concept of a Life as a Peasant, but I never thought it was pulled off quite right in Wc3. More often than not it just turned into an RTS.
Well, seeing as this post was necroed I'll weigh in too. I'm bothered by both sides of this argument. Yes, on the one hand I don't prefer tug/frenzy maps and acknowledge they take less time to make (but do take long to polish). But on the other hand (having had a few popular maps) what may seem simple or trivial in a map may have taken LOTS of balance/polish to be what you see now.
As a player (from the golden age of war3) I am not entirely happy with the choice and selection... Why are people playing the same maps since beta? War3 had a much higher map turnover rate (good and bad) aside from dota. I guess popularity is a fault here; hopefully 1.3 will prove this....
I completely missed the necropost. We need warnings, dammit.
That said, it's an interesting topic.
@Mozared: Go
Haha I always check now... necroing is actually really common on sc2mapster i find.
And yeah, it really is an interesting topic... we're all affected by it. We've seen lots of these posts since the beta about players (not just high n mighty mappers) frustrated... Well, there's hundreds of us @sc2mapster with a few people having popular maps, dozen or so random mappers not associated with sc2mapster who have popular maps, and then finally there's the hundred thousand or w/e maps blizzard said are published that aren't popular.