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I have almost all of the tier 3 units completed, and every single one except the Ghost is completely different from the tooltips in the latest online version. I just have to make the waves, but due some tricky mechanics and surprises I have planned for tier 3, this won't be as simple for me to make as tier 2 was.
Ok I'm sorry if this is angry... but i've played your map dozens of times...and i always get the same result on the endless wave... i could beat it...IF the units actually worked! the tier 3 tower does absolutely nothing... the hightemplar/archons that you can build for how amazingly expensive they are... are completely useless... the tier 3 turret does absolutely nothing... theres a bug that keeps the sniper multiplier damage on their that doesnt work past 1 upgrade... some upgrades arent even on their... 1 upgrade is just a highlighted box which is unclickable. OMG please finish this!
Hasn't died! I'm working on Tier 3 every day, and making good progress. Should have a pre tier 3 update soon, with the new tier 3 units in place (I've scrapped most of the old ones), and the waves will be coming soon after that.
I notice that there hasn't been an update for a while on this map... I really hope that it hasn't died because this map has real potential to be a fantastic map.
Oh, I should have posted a list of bugs along with my complaint - in an attempt to be helpful, here's the bugs I've seen:
1) Super Bunker taunt is buggy. When player 1 (top) taunts, it will often pull mobs from other players (specifically player 3, the bottom player). If the taunt's wears off and the mobs are enroute to the top base, they can suddenly just stop and attack whatever is nearby, including the comm tower. In later waves (15-19) this means you can lose your comm tower really fast whenever player 1 taunts. I've also seen player 4 (left side) taunt people off of player 3 (south). For ground units it's not a huge problem, but when nydus worms spawn in back, whoever did the taunting gets all your nydus spawns. In waves 14+, they also get your airborne attackers attacking them from the back - and it's worse if the taunt wears off before they get there and you have airborne units hitting the comm center or command center.
Also, as player 3 trying to use taunt, I often noticed that the mobs that weren't running off to another player's base completely ignored the taunt. They might make a short little move towards the bunker, but less than a second later are back attacking whatever they please.
2) If a player drops while in the loading screen, the game doesn't realize it until wave 1, which means you watch the intro and wait the full setup period.
3) The "vote to skip to tier x" option that appears in the initial setup period can get stuck on your screen for the whole match. When this happened, I confirmed with the other players that it was stuck on their screen, too. We tried voting to skip and voting both yes and no - neither had any result and the vote buttons always popped back onto the screen.
4) The firebat barracks, when salvaged, leaves behind a really annoying large corpse that never goes away.
In conclusions, I have figured out the easiest way to beat this map is just to build some bunkers, fill them with marines. Repeat until 8 bunkers for t1. For t2, convert to reapers. Fill 8 bunkers with repears. Voila, beat the game. It's super easy, because you never need to do taunts or forcefields and you never lose any units or structures and only take bunker damage when the occasional nydus worm causes some concentrated fire. It's also really boring, and makes me wonder why turrets, firebats, etc, were bothered with in the game. They all just cost you money and are completely unncessary to win.
My strategy resulted in a 3 hr 5 minute game before I quit against the endless wave. The endless wave was getting harder, but not fast enough to be a problem... I might have been able to go another hour on it.
tanks got nerfed but still work just fine, and if you build your def out far enough you can have your tanks go kill nydus while super bunkers taunt everything off them
I like the concept of the map, but with recent changes it seems that tier 2 is really boring - all the non-reaper units have limited uses. IMs not being able to be healed made them a losing proposition - you will always lose money going after nydus worms, and you can't play this in a way that causes you to lose units/money on a regular basis. Siege tanks were nerfed, and now no one bothers with them. Medivacs were nerfed (used on IMs) and virtually no one uses them (except me, because I like the fort buff on defense). Immortals were nerfed, and again no one bothers with them.
So it's just a bunch of reapers in bunkers. T2 is boring =(. Even using T1 units in T2 was nerfed, which was the only interesting thing I could find to do in T2.
Played the hell out of this, but it's very unforgivable and many players get overwhelmed early on if they dont focus on marines and bunkers. I've seen many different variations (and tried a few myself) but none of them can survive. At best, you can add a few medics or marauders to provide a nice buff but the cost of upgrading the barracks and the unit itself barely pays off (most of them require one of the upgrades to be useful, like range for hellions and marauders).
Turrets are similiar, requiring a few upgrades to be remotely useful. Apart from a slight range advantage, another bunker filled with marines seems to be more useful, less fragile, and salvageable. Limiting supply more could help, but they are still a huge waste of minerals in the long run.
Same for tier two, although I found Immortals and Medivacs to be very useful for dealing with distant Nydus Worms. Speaking of which, those tend to throw in an annoying luck factor in T2 since they can keep reappearing somewhere in the middle and whittle your defenses down with additional spawns. Reaching them is almost impossible even with the above combo, since every wave from it forces you to stop, nevermind fighting against the stream of the normal wave.
I'd also like to see some teamplay elements like shared upgrades or something. As it is, it's pretty much every player for himself, and even when a player is overrun, he can just leave and any remaining enemies on his side vanish before they could do any real harm. I've never seen a gameover from the comm tower being destroyed as a result. However, I've seen players trying to draw enemies away from the tower and end up getting overrun themselves.
[BUG]: Infested marines are no longer healed by medivacs.
[NOTE]: Thanks for the update, I enjoyed the slight changes to the waves
Quote from Vileguy:
My biggest problem are turrets. Why do you bother putting them in? They have just as bad of range as everything else before upgrading them. They aren't powerful enough to justify their cost. Most importantly, they're impossible to keep alive. They don't have a heal ability, u can't upgrade their armor, and they aren't durable to begin with. Also significant is the fact that they don't sell for their upgrades. They are awful in every way. At least could you make upgrades at the engineering bay and apply to all turrets? The current system is terrible.
Turrets are very useful for tier 1. If you surround them they will take very little to no damage. The loss of minerals do to salvage not tacking upgrades into account is painful but no way game breaking. With 3 bunkers and 6 turrets I will have 1k minerals at the start of wave 11.
I also think a difficulty setting will add more incentive for veterans to play. Maybe increase wave density and speed, and lower the wave duration.
Replayability seems to end the moment someone figures out a build that beats the game every time, especially every time without taking much damage or requiring much attention and accumulating a large pool of surplus minerals.
Just played the v0.8 on US, and the firebatt range reducer doesnt work on most T2 mobs anymore :(
I went only units (hellions for t1), and those zealots in wave 9 almost killed me, ended up having 500 less minerals saved up for t2 than usual. The reaper nerf was still doable but it made it a lot more challenging, perhaps it was due to my lack of minerals for upgrades, but i know all 3 other players got their bunkers overwhelmed somethin fierce due to lack of DPS.
Good game but a little easy, would be nice if you could vote for a difficulty to challenge some. I've done bad strategies just to see how far I can go because I've beaten it several times.
Marines and Reapers are enough to beat all 20 levels. You just need a good build setup.
Neurotoxin is amazing. It's incredibly powerful, unfortunately it often makes your units to go your neighbors base instead, even without anything walled off. I think those paths between the sides are more harm than good.
Marauders are quite terrible. They're prob the only unit that warrants the +damage to slowed units upgrade. I wouldn't get that for any other unit if it only applies to the marines.
Hellions are the best. Not necessarily overpowered, but every experienced player who isn't trying something less effective will use them.
Medics are fine but I'd like to know about the 30% healing. They do 5-8 damage I think, which means they would heal for a max of 2 with 7 damage?
Firebats are ok. Not as good as hellions, but having up to 3 for the hydra and broodlord level is very convenient.
Tier 2 units are good. Haven't tried infested marines, but really who wants to use a melee unit? These should go the way of the zealot.
Tanks are fine. The long range upgrade is pretty worthless imo.
Immortals are fine, but I wouldn't bother with their attack speed upgrade, knowing fully well what it's useful for.
Medivacs are definitely amazing. They make the game trivial. I just played and got 6 of them, 3 for myself and 3 for my friend. I had too much money so I had every upgrade with only 6 bunkers full of reapers and 3 firebats. I didn't have to heal a single bunker on round 20.
Stalkers seem ok but there's so little air they're too expensive. Why not just spend 250 and make air trivial except for the broodlords, which are easily managed with spart use of neurotoxin.
My biggest problem are turrets. Why do you bother putting them in? They have just as bad of range as everything else before upgrading them. They aren't powerful enough to justify their cost. Most importantly, they're impossible to keep alive. They don't have a heal ability, u can't upgrade their armor, and they aren't durable to begin with. Also significant is the fact that they don't sell for their upgrades. They are awful in every way. At least could you make upgrades at the engineering bay and apply to all turrets? The current system is terrible.
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Posted Sep 9, 2010At least give us a teaser with the new t3 units for the endless wave. Then at least we can play around with new stuff.
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Posted Sep 9, 2010Haha, I'm sorry to keep you guys waiting. :X
I have almost all of the tier 3 units completed, and every single one except the Ghost is completely different from the tooltips in the latest online version. I just have to make the waves, but due some tricky mechanics and surprises I have planned for tier 3, this won't be as simple for me to make as tier 2 was.
Hopefully I'll have it done soon!
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Posted Sep 9, 2010yea thats the unfinished tier for ya!
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Posted Sep 9, 2010Ok I'm sorry if this is angry... but i've played your map dozens of times...and i always get the same result on the endless wave... i could beat it...IF the units actually worked! the tier 3 tower does absolutely nothing... the hightemplar/archons that you can build for how amazingly expensive they are... are completely useless... the tier 3 turret does absolutely nothing... theres a bug that keeps the sniper multiplier damage on their that doesnt work past 1 upgrade... some upgrades arent even on their... 1 upgrade is just a highlighted box which is unclickable. OMG please finish this!
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Posted Sep 5, 2010Hasn't died! I'm working on Tier 3 every day, and making good progress. Should have a pre tier 3 update soon, with the new tier 3 units in place (I've scrapped most of the old ones), and the waves will be coming soon after that.
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Posted Sep 4, 2010I notice that there hasn't been an update for a while on this map... I really hope that it hasn't died because this map has real potential to be a fantastic map.
Any updates, RainGame?
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Posted Aug 27, 2010Please.... RainGame. Upload here this great game :D Pleeeease !!! I so much long for it.
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Posted Aug 26, 2010Oh, I should have posted a list of bugs along with my complaint - in an attempt to be helpful, here's the bugs I've seen:
1) Super Bunker taunt is buggy. When player 1 (top) taunts, it will often pull mobs from other players (specifically player 3, the bottom player). If the taunt's wears off and the mobs are enroute to the top base, they can suddenly just stop and attack whatever is nearby, including the comm tower. In later waves (15-19) this means you can lose your comm tower really fast whenever player 1 taunts. I've also seen player 4 (left side) taunt people off of player 3 (south). For ground units it's not a huge problem, but when nydus worms spawn in back, whoever did the taunting gets all your nydus spawns. In waves 14+, they also get your airborne attackers attacking them from the back - and it's worse if the taunt wears off before they get there and you have airborne units hitting the comm center or command center.
Also, as player 3 trying to use taunt, I often noticed that the mobs that weren't running off to another player's base completely ignored the taunt. They might make a short little move towards the bunker, but less than a second later are back attacking whatever they please.
2) If a player drops while in the loading screen, the game doesn't realize it until wave 1, which means you watch the intro and wait the full setup period.
3) The "vote to skip to tier x" option that appears in the initial setup period can get stuck on your screen for the whole match. When this happened, I confirmed with the other players that it was stuck on their screen, too. We tried voting to skip and voting both yes and no - neither had any result and the vote buttons always popped back onto the screen.
4) The firebat barracks, when salvaged, leaves behind a really annoying large corpse that never goes away.
In conclusions, I have figured out the easiest way to beat this map is just to build some bunkers, fill them with marines. Repeat until 8 bunkers for t1. For t2, convert to reapers. Fill 8 bunkers with repears. Voila, beat the game. It's super easy, because you never need to do taunts or forcefields and you never lose any units or structures and only take bunker damage when the occasional nydus worm causes some concentrated fire. It's also really boring, and makes me wonder why turrets, firebats, etc, were bothered with in the game. They all just cost you money and are completely unncessary to win.
My strategy resulted in a 3 hr 5 minute game before I quit against the endless wave. The endless wave was getting harder, but not fast enough to be a problem... I might have been able to go another hour on it.
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Posted Aug 25, 2010tanks got nerfed but still work just fine, and if you build your def out far enough you can have your tanks go kill nydus while super bunkers taunt everything off them
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Posted Aug 25, 2010I like the concept of the map, but with recent changes it seems that tier 2 is really boring - all the non-reaper units have limited uses. IMs not being able to be healed made them a losing proposition - you will always lose money going after nydus worms, and you can't play this in a way that causes you to lose units/money on a regular basis. Siege tanks were nerfed, and now no one bothers with them. Medivacs were nerfed (used on IMs) and virtually no one uses them (except me, because I like the fort buff on defense). Immortals were nerfed, and again no one bothers with them.
So it's just a bunch of reapers in bunkers. T2 is boring =(. Even using T1 units in T2 was nerfed, which was the only interesting thing I could find to do in T2.
T1 is fun, but T2 needs something to spice it up.
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Posted Aug 22, 2010Played the hell out of this, but it's very unforgivable and many players get overwhelmed early on if they dont focus on marines and bunkers. I've seen many different variations (and tried a few myself) but none of them can survive. At best, you can add a few medics or marauders to provide a nice buff but the cost of upgrading the barracks and the unit itself barely pays off (most of them require one of the upgrades to be useful, like range for hellions and marauders). Turrets are similiar, requiring a few upgrades to be remotely useful. Apart from a slight range advantage, another bunker filled with marines seems to be more useful, less fragile, and salvageable. Limiting supply more could help, but they are still a huge waste of minerals in the long run.
Same for tier two, although I found Immortals and Medivacs to be very useful for dealing with distant Nydus Worms. Speaking of which, those tend to throw in an annoying luck factor in T2 since they can keep reappearing somewhere in the middle and whittle your defenses down with additional spawns. Reaching them is almost impossible even with the above combo, since every wave from it forces you to stop, nevermind fighting against the stream of the normal wave.
I'd also like to see some teamplay elements like shared upgrades or something. As it is, it's pretty much every player for himself, and even when a player is overrun, he can just leave and any remaining enemies on his side vanish before they could do any real harm. I've never seen a gameover from the comm tower being destroyed as a result. However, I've seen players trying to draw enemies away from the tower and end up getting overrun themselves.
Overall though, fun map.
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Posted Aug 22, 2010please can you upload here latest version of this great map. I really want to play it =) It´s nothing complicated. =)
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Posted Aug 21, 2010"[BUG]: Infested marines are no longer healed by medivacs."
Not a bug. It's intended! Read the patch notes! Also, it says they can't be healed on their passive ability.
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Posted Aug 21, 2010[BUG]: Infested marines are no longer healed by medivacs.
[NOTE]: Thanks for the update, I enjoyed the slight changes to the waves
Turrets are very useful for tier 1. If you surround them they will take very little to no damage. The loss of minerals do to salvage not tacking upgrades into account is painful but no way game breaking. With 3 bunkers and 6 turrets I will have 1k minerals at the start of wave 11.
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Posted Aug 21, 2010I also think a difficulty setting will add more incentive for veterans to play. Maybe increase wave density and speed, and lower the wave duration.
Replayability seems to end the moment someone figures out a build that beats the game every time, especially every time without taking much damage or requiring much attention and accumulating a large pool of surplus minerals.
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Posted Aug 20, 2010Latest version now on Europe!
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Posted Aug 19, 2010I forgot to mention the wave 20 spawning of units doesnt always work, in fact like 1/2 to 1/3 of the things that drop down actually spawn units
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Posted Aug 19, 2010Just played the v0.8 on US, and the firebatt range reducer doesnt work on most T2 mobs anymore :(
I went only units (hellions for t1), and those zealots in wave 9 almost killed me, ended up having 500 less minerals saved up for t2 than usual. The reaper nerf was still doable but it made it a lot more challenging, perhaps it was due to my lack of minerals for upgrades, but i know all 3 other players got their bunkers overwhelmed somethin fierce due to lack of DPS.
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Posted Aug 19, 2010Good game but a little easy, would be nice if you could vote for a difficulty to challenge some. I've done bad strategies just to see how far I can go because I've beaten it several times.
Marines and Reapers are enough to beat all 20 levels. You just need a good build setup.
Neurotoxin is amazing. It's incredibly powerful, unfortunately it often makes your units to go your neighbors base instead, even without anything walled off. I think those paths between the sides are more harm than good.
Marauders are quite terrible. They're prob the only unit that warrants the +damage to slowed units upgrade. I wouldn't get that for any other unit if it only applies to the marines.
Hellions are the best. Not necessarily overpowered, but every experienced player who isn't trying something less effective will use them.
Medics are fine but I'd like to know about the 30% healing. They do 5-8 damage I think, which means they would heal for a max of 2 with 7 damage?
Firebats are ok. Not as good as hellions, but having up to 3 for the hydra and broodlord level is very convenient.
Tier 2 units are good. Haven't tried infested marines, but really who wants to use a melee unit? These should go the way of the zealot.
Tanks are fine. The long range upgrade is pretty worthless imo.
Immortals are fine, but I wouldn't bother with their attack speed upgrade, knowing fully well what it's useful for.
Medivacs are definitely amazing. They make the game trivial. I just played and got 6 of them, 3 for myself and 3 for my friend. I had too much money so I had every upgrade with only 6 bunkers full of reapers and 3 firebats. I didn't have to heal a single bunker on round 20.
Stalkers seem ok but there's so little air they're too expensive. Why not just spend 250 and make air trivial except for the broodlords, which are easily managed with spart use of neurotoxin.
My biggest problem are turrets. Why do you bother putting them in? They have just as bad of range as everything else before upgrading them. They aren't powerful enough to justify their cost. Most importantly, they're impossible to keep alive. They don't have a heal ability, u can't upgrade their armor, and they aren't durable to begin with. Also significant is the fact that they don't sell for their upgrades. They are awful in every way. At least could you make upgrades at the engineering bay and apply to all turrets? The current system is terrible.